Received: from malur.postgresql.org ([217.196.149.56]) by arkaria.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jOMqJ-0003rR-0h for pgadmin-support@arkaria.postgresql.org; Tue, 14 Apr 2020 14:47:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=malur.postgresql.org) by malur.postgresql.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jOMqH-0005X0-U3 for pgadmin-support@arkaria.postgresql.org; Tue, 14 Apr 2020 14:47:13 +0000 Received: from magus.postgresql.org ([2a02:c0:301:0:ffff::29]) by malur.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jOMqH-0005Wl-Gy for pgadmin-support@lists.postgresql.org; Tue, 14 Apr 2020 14:47:13 +0000 Received: from mail-ed1-x543.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::543]) by magus.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jOMqE-0006XO-2i for pgadmin-support@postgresql.org; Tue, 14 Apr 2020 14:47:13 +0000 Received: by mail-ed1-x543.google.com with SMTP id cb27so17442750edb.11 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 2020 07:47:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=pgadmin.org; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=Gg/pxCXMmYrkHujrlPWy/CPZno0zPBAvFKwTRn/YDRA=; b=p0tELIn2WBnIek3jdF4+GIEJNqfqk0baMP1SQHYwlhbZA46Ge+OpnEyU9b6kjiZMui jLMcVdWE4u2tG/znw65gpIpgHhCT4bsw5yvW4IXXItgMbLsibSfC8XZOdrDOl3RwhIAF 0jkOtBbfTEOwudIWsoH0A3ExFc5Ywa2zh5kb76SODnBNISBg0DLSCYg3yqEBd8Gelink 75XYLyLw2MmQYWarYxd5MZG0jKgYjqK75+YlV1dPTRuHwofDQdyNXSVdJ98ILaDGU17P uNaoEfcIfMdBPkyWovE0lj2cdoMqWSfUyF6nVk4sh/IO39ldoXl4cfj9zI2ffusx446B euig== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=Gg/pxCXMmYrkHujrlPWy/CPZno0zPBAvFKwTRn/YDRA=; b=kqm2pYDmsZ4s84pWA6cH16dpiVDyP1q7zx+W7OIosjkPwizUfvXOxYqAw3yTLRkydX C9yHPpZ+eQqYaTuRQRS40p12ZqsPZLzrtth0bfZPUIZ7uhKZxyp2Vn5d5rrhC7xuZj93 GhH9EJpLKSGqMT0a4rjCUeJNJeZWHOg/xgPchgQDMzD9dzn9+MYENO6bhuxjvi/UQjKm GxMxt6Jh96srsuVU+tgdl4tQoQJNup5aelnUKQWqgJHo6WPPJrVdRcSPBT8TO0L/BCmO IWnFT7BtsH8ckyTtK7dtnfYWde5KbABN9srqtAVLbotUxMN+hwZdMXP4pSAjAe09AyTd qVxw== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuZLV4/9UY0Ij0pVyOiREvqnI5JzeQGxtTd9BbJCNQ+TanVsDYE3 eB6n5ACt/F5h6iQw2qLAAwnNTkbg1GblQ1c5Huwm/Q== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypJs12QZfn/qNINY4yjeg8kXMkZdZZ+clIZpMn8vRQkXYRscZhTaSgEAKrUxeR9tLXGUTyE7OEavG4AlZUxgTgo= X-Received: by 2002:aa7:d857:: with SMTP id f23mr20569509eds.235.1586875629189; Tue, 14 Apr 2020 07:47:09 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <1e6b5a0b-2fc9-1cac-f13a-bcc84f02e00e@darrenduncan.net> <6148f1ed-8eee-931e-06a1-23c64d790cf5@darrenduncan.net> In-Reply-To: From: Dave Page Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2020 15:46:56 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Proposal: Drop support for Internet Explorer To: Neel Patel Cc: Khushboo Vashi , Darren Duncan , pgAdmin Support , pgadmin-hackers , Akshay Joshi Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="0000000000002e65cb05a341467a" List-Id: List-Help: List-Subscribe: List-Post: List-Owner: List-Archive: Precedence: bulk --0000000000002e65cb05a341467a Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000002e65c905a3414678" --0000000000002e65c905a3414678 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Ooops. Thanks for catching that. Here it is. On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 3:45 PM Neel Patel wrote: > Hi Dave, > > Looks like patch is missing in attachment. > > Thanks, > Neel Patel > > > On Tue 14 Apr, 2020, 6:53 PM Dave Page, wrote: > >> Here's an updated patch that gives a slightly different message if the >> browser is unknown vs. unsupported/deprecated. As with the previous patch, >> the check can be disabled in the config. >> >> On Fri, Apr 10, 2020 at 5:07 AM Khushboo Vashi < >> khushboo.vashi@enterprisedb.com> wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Apr 9, 2020 at 11:57 PM Darren Duncan >>> wrote: >>> >>>> The patch looks good as much as I understand it, but this raises an >>>> important >>>> question: >>>> >>>> How should one best handle minority browsers that may be completely >>>> modern but >>>> you may not specifically know about them? Such as the newer crop of >>>> browsers >>>> that emphasize stronger privacy or may have fewer identifiers? >>>> >>>> While going on a whitelist as the patch essentially does for known good >>>> browsers >>>> is conservative, I feel that an alteration would be good. >>>> >>>> I propose dividing the browsers/environments into 3 categories, which >>>> are >>>> recognized-supported, recognized-unsupported, and unrecognized. >>>> >>> >>>> So the unsupported older versions of supported browsers get a stronger >>>> message >>>> encouraging a browser switch as they are recognized as unsupported, >>>> while >>>> unrecognized browsers get a different weaker message saying they >>>> weren't >>>> recognized so we can't determine if they'd work; both can point to the >>>> list of >>>> known supported browsers. >>>> >>>> I do agree with this suggestion. >>> >>> >>>> Related to this, there could be an application toggle that affects the >>>> unrecognized category where users can basically say, yes I understand >>>> you don't >>>> recognize this browser, please hide the warning, or something like that. >>>> >>>> Also, it probably goes without saying, but the code/templates will need >>>> to be >>>> structured in such a way that the warning message uses about plain as >>>> possible >>>> HTML so that if the browser doesn't support displaying the UI in >>>> general it can >>>> at least display the message. >>>> >>>> -- Darren Duncan >>>> >>>> On 2020-04-09 4:36 a.m., Dave Page wrote: >>>> > Hi >>>> > >>>> > On Thu, Apr 9, 2020 at 12:26 AM Darren Duncan wrote: >>>> > >>>> > If its hard to know how many people are actually using Internet >>>> Explorer: >>>> > >>>> > You could make the next release of pgAdmin display a message >>>> occasionally to >>>> > users of Internet Explorer saying that Internet Explorer will no >>>> longer be >>>> > officially supported in a future version, and when that version >>>> comes the >>>> > message says now no longer supported. >>>> > >>>> > You can then see how many people contact you about this to >>>> express concern. >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > Good idea. I've hacked up a patch to warn users if they're using a >>>> deprecated or >>>> > unsupported browser. >>>> > >>>> > CCing Akshay for a review :-) >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > Dave Page >>>> > Blog: http://pgsnake.blogspot.com >>>> > Twitter: @pgsnake >>>> > >>>> > EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com >>>> > The Enterprise PostgreSQL Company >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >> -- >> Dave Page >> Blog: http://pgsnake.blogspot.com >> Twitter: @pgsnake >> >> EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com >> The Enterprise PostgreSQL Company >> > -- Dave Page Blog: http://pgsnake.blogspot.com Twitter: @pgsnake EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com The Enterprise PostgreSQL Company --0000000000002e65c905a3414678 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ooops. Thanks for catching that. Here it is.

On Tue, Apr 14= , 2020 at 3:45 PM Neel Patel <neel.patel@enterprisedb.com> wrote:
Hi Dave,=C2=A0=C2= =A0

Looks like patch is missin= g in attachment.

Thanks,=
Neel Patel


=
On Tue 14 Apr, 2020, 6:53 PM Dave Page, <dpage@pgadmin.org> wrote:
=
Here's an updated patch that gives a slightly different message if= the browser is unknown vs. unsupported/deprecated. As with the previous pa= tch, the check can be disabled in the config.

On Fri, Apr 10, 2020 at 5:07 A= M Khushboo Vashi <khushboo.vashi@enterprisedb.com> w= rote:


On Thu, Apr 9, 2020 at 11:57 PM Darren Duncan= <darren@darrenduncan.net> wrote:
The patch looks good as much as I unders= tand it, but this raises an important
question:

How should one best handle minority browsers that may be completely modern = but
you may not specifically know about them?=C2=A0 Such as the newer crop of b= rowsers
that emphasize stronger privacy or may have fewer identifiers?

While going on a whitelist as the patch essentially does for known good bro= wsers
is conservative, I feel that an alteration would be good.

I propose dividing the browsers/environments into 3 categories, which are <= br> recognized-supported, recognized-unsupported, and unrecognized.

So the unsupported older versions of supported browsers get a stronger mess= age
encouraging a browser switch as they are recognized as unsupported, while <= br> unrecognized browsers get a different weaker message saying they weren'= t
recognized so we can't determine if they'd work; both can point to = the list of
known supported browsers.

I do agree with this suggestion.
=C2=A0
Related to this, there could be an application toggle that affects the
unrecognized category where users can basically say, yes I understand you d= on't
recognize this browser, please hide the warning, or something like that.
Also, it probably goes without saying, but the code/templates will need to = be
structured in such a way that the warning message uses about plain as possi= ble
HTML so that if the browser doesn't support displaying the UI in genera= l it can
at least display the message.

-- Darren Duncan

On 2020-04-09 4:36 a.m., Dave Page wrote:
> Hi
>
> On Thu, Apr 9, 2020 at 12:26 AM Darren Duncan wrote:
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0If its hard to know how many people are actually us= ing Internet Explorer:
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0You could make the next release of pgAdmin display = a message occasionally to
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0users of Internet Explorer saying that Internet Exp= lorer will no longer be
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0officially supported in a future version, and when = that version comes the
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0message says now no longer supported.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0You can then see how many people contact you about = this to express concern.
>
>
> Good idea. I've hacked up a patch to warn users if they're usi= ng a deprecated or
> unsupported browser.
>
> CCing Akshay for a review :-)
>
> --
> Dave Page
> Blog: http://pgsnake.blogspot.com
> Twitter: @pgsnake
>
> EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com
> The Enterprise PostgreSQL Company





--
Dave Page
Blog: http://pgsnake.blogspot.com
Twitter: @pgsnake<= br>
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com
The Enterprise= PostgreSQL Company


--
Dave Page
Blog: http://pgsnake.blogspot.com
Twitter: @p= gsnake

EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com
The Enterprise PostgreSQL = Company
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