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To: Pgsql-admin <pgsql-admin@lists.postgresql.org>
From: listy <listy@localities.work>
Subject: upgrade from 13 to 16
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Hi guys.

Is upgrade from ver. 13 to 16 possible?

-> $ sudo -u postgres pg_upgrade -D /var/lib/pgsql/data/

You must identify the directory where the old cluster 
binaries reside.
Please use the -b command-line option or the PGBINOLD 
environment variable.
Failure, exiting

Or is a restoration from a backup the only way?

many thanks, L.
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    <font size="2" face="Courier 10 Pitch">Hi guys.<br>
      <br>
      Is upgrade from ver. 13 to 16 possible?<br>
      <br>
      -&gt; $ sudo -u postgres pg_upgrade -D /var/lib/pgsql/data/<br>
      <br>
      You must identify the directory where the old cluster binaries
      reside.<br>
      Please use the -b command-line option or the PGBINOLD environment
      variable.<br>
      Failure, exiting<br>
      <br>
      Or is a restoration from a backup the only way?<br>
      <br>
      many thanks, L.</font>
  </body>
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Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2026 13:49:00 +0100
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Subject: Re: upgrade from 13 to 16
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Hi listy,

On Mon, Mar 2, 2026 at 1:43=E2=80=AFPM listy <listy@localities.work> wrote:

>
> Is upgrade from ver. 13 to 16 possible?
>
 it is. You need to use the latest pg_upgrade binary (from version 16 in
this case)


>
> -> $ sudo -u postgres pg_upgrade -D /var/lib/pgsql/data/
>
>
You must identify the directory where the old cluster binaries reside.
>

It tells you exactly what to do. pg_upgrade requires both the old and new
clusters, data dirs and binaries.  So you need to specify aloof -b, -B, -d
and -D


> Please use the -b command-line option or the PGBINOLD environment variabl=
e.
> Failure, exiting
>
> Or is a restoration from a backup the only way?
>
> many thanks, L.
>


--=20
Ilya Kosmodemiansky
CEO, Founder

Data Egret GmbH
Your remote PostgreSQL DBA team
T.: +49 6821 919 3297
ik@dataegret.com

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi listy,</div><br><div class=3D"gmail_qu=
ote gmail_quote_container"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Ma=
r 2, 2026 at 1:43=E2=80=AFPM listy &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:listy@localities.w=
ork">listy@localities.work</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gma=
il_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,2=
04,204);padding-left:1ex"><u></u>

 =20

   =20
 =20
  <div><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Courier 10 Pitch"><br>
      Is upgrade from ver. 13 to 16 possible?<br></font></div></blockquote>=
<div>=C2=A0it is. You need to use the latest pg_upgrade binary (from versio=
n 16 in this case)=C2=A0<br></div><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gma=
il_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,2=
04,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Courier 10 Pitch">
      <br>
      -&gt; $ sudo -u postgres pg_upgrade -D /var/lib/pgsql/data/<br>
      </font>=C2=A0</div></blockquote><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" sty=
le=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);paddi=
ng-left:1ex"><div><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Courier 10 Pitch">
      You must identify the directory where the old cluster binaries
      reside.<br></font></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>It tells you=
 exactly what to do. pg_upgrade requires both the old and new clusters, dat=
a dirs and binaries.=C2=A0=C2=A0So you need to specify aloof=C2=A0-b, -B, -=
d and -D</div><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left=
:1ex"><div><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Courier 10 Pitch">
      Please use the -b command-line option or the PGBINOLD environment
      variable.<br>
      Failure, exiting<br>
      <br>
      Or is a restoration from a backup the only way?<br>
      <br>
      many thanks, L.</font>
  </div>

</blockquote></div><div><br clear=3D"all"></div><br><span class=3D"gmail_si=
gnature_prefix">-- </span><br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature"><d=
iv dir=3D"ltr"><div>Ilya Kosmodemiansky</div><div>CEO, Founder</div><br>Dat=
a Egret GmbH<br>Your remote PostgreSQL DBA team<br>T.: +49 6821 919 3297<br=
><a href=3D"mailto:ik@dataegret.com" target=3D"_blank">ik@dataegret.com</a>=
<br><br><br></div></div></div>

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Subject: Re: upgrade from 13 to 16
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So, for now & the future "issues"...
Since on LInux - unless tampered with manually - binaries 
get replaced upon upgrades of a package:
Is it worthwhile tampering with binaries as opposed to 
starting anew and with a backup? (which I eventually did, I 
get it might be a personal preference)

many thanks, L.
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    <font size="2" face="Courier 10 Pitch">So, for now &amp; the future
      "issues"...<br>
      Since on LInux - unless tampered with manually - binaries get
      replaced upon upgrades of a package:<br>
      Is it worthwhile tampering with binaries as opposed to starting
      anew and with a backup? (which I eventually did, I get it might be
      a personal preference)<br>
      <br>
      many thanks, L.</font>
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Subject: Re: upgrade from 13 to 16
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On Mon, Mar 2, 2026 at 8:48=E2=80=AFAM listy <listy@localities.work> wrote:

> So, for now & the future "issues"...
> Since on LInux - unless tampered with manually - binaries get replaced
> upon upgrades of a package:
>

Please clarify.  Because the application directories created by RPMs and
debs in the PGDG repository (which I recommend that you use instead of the
ones from your distro) are multi-version:

$ ls -1 /usr | grep pgsql
pgsql-13
pgsql-14
pgsql-15
pgsql-16
pgsql-17
pgsql-9.6

--=20
Death to <Redacted>, and butter sauce.
Don't boil me, I'm still alive.
<Redacted> lobster!

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Mon, Mar 2, 2026 at 8:48=E2=80=AFAM li=
sty &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:listy@localities.work">listy@localities.work</a>&=
gt; wrote:</div><div class=3D"gmail_quote gmail_quote_container"><blockquot=
e class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px s=
olid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><u></u>

 =20
   =20
 =20
  <div>
    <font size=3D"2" face=3D"Courier 10 Pitch">So, for now &amp; the future
      &quot;issues&quot;...<br>
      Since on LInux - unless tampered with manually - binaries get
      replaced upon upgrades of a package:<br></font></div></blockquote><di=
v><br></div><div>Please clarify.=C2=A0 Because the application directories =
created by RPMs and debs in the PGDG repository (which I recommend that you=
 use instead of the ones from your distro) are multi-version:</div><div><br=
></div><div>$ ls -1 /usr | grep pgsql<br>pgsql-13<br>pgsql-14<br>pgsql-15<b=
r>pgsql-16<br>pgsql-17<br>pgsql-9.6</div><div><br></div></div><span class=
=3D"gmail_signature_prefix">-- </span><br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_s=
ignature"><div dir=3D"ltr">Death to &lt;Redacted&gt;, and butter sauce.<div=
>Don&#39;t boil me, I&#39;m still alive.<br><div><div>&lt;Redacted&gt; lobs=
ter!</div></div></div></div></div></div>

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Subject: Re: upgrade from 13 to 16
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Cannot say about Debian but RHEL family (perhaps exceptions 
exist) do not, certainly not on Centos, Ubuntu which I use, yes.
But also rhel/centos do not do major PGsql rel. upgrade 
within the same/one OS release, I do not think so.
What happened to me - what I did rather - was upgrade from 
c9 to c10. (not officially supported.)
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    <font size="2" face="Courier 10 Pitch">Cannot say about Debian but
      RHEL family (perhaps exceptions exist) do not, certainly not on
      Centos, Ubuntu which I use, yes.<br>
      But also rhel/centos do not do major PGsql rel. upgrade within the
      same/one OS release, I do not think so.<br>
      What happened to me - what I did rather - was upgrade from c9 to
      c10. (not officially supported.)</font>
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From: Ron Johnson <ronljohnsonjr@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: upgrade from 13 to 16
To: Pgsql-admin <pgsql-admin@lists.postgresql.org>
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On Mon, Mar 2, 2026 at 9:09=E2=80=AFAM listy <listy@localities.work> wrote:

> Cannot say about Debian but RHEL family (perhaps exceptions exist) do not=
,
> certainly not on Centos, Ubuntu which I use, yes.
> But also rhel/centos do not do major PGsql rel. upgrade within the
> same/one OS release, I do not think so.
> What happened to me - what I did rather - was upgrade from c9 to c10. (no=
t
> officially supported.)
>

This is why I strongly urge you to use the PGDG repositories, not the
packages which RHEL builds.

--=20
Death to <Redacted>, and butter sauce.
Don't boil me, I'm still alive.
<Redacted> lobster!

--0000000000001d10a6064c0b72d8
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Mon, Mar 2, 2026 at 9:09=E2=80=AFAM li=
sty &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:listy@localities.work">listy@localities.work</a>&=
gt; wrote:</div><div class=3D"gmail_quote gmail_quote_container"><blockquot=
e class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px s=
olid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><u></u>

 =20
   =20
 =20
  <div>
    <font size=3D"2" face=3D"Courier 10 Pitch">Cannot say about Debian but
      RHEL family (perhaps exceptions exist) do not, certainly not on
      Centos, Ubuntu which I use, yes.<br>
      But also rhel/centos do not do major PGsql rel. upgrade within the
      same/one OS release, I do not think so.<br>
      What happened to me - what I did rather - was upgrade from c9 to
      c10. (not officially supported.)</font>
  </div>

</blockquote></div><div><br clear=3D"all"></div><div>This is why I strongly=
 urge you to use the PGDG repositories, not the packages which RHEL builds.=
</div><div><br></div><span class=3D"gmail_signature_prefix">-- </span><br><=
div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr">Death to &lt;Red=
acted&gt;, and butter sauce.<div>Don&#39;t boil me, I&#39;m still alive.<br=
><div><div>&lt;Redacted&gt; lobster!</div></div></div></div></div></div>

--0000000000001d10a6064c0b72d8--





From laurenz.albe@cybertec.at Fri May  22 05:40:07 2026
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Subject: Re: upgrade from 13 to 16
From: Laurenz Albe <laurenz.albe@cybertec.at>
To: listy <listy@localities.work>, Pgsql-admin
	 <pgsql-admin@lists.postgresql.org>
Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2026 15:34:30 +0100
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On Mon, 2026-03-02 at 13:43 +0100, listy wrote:
> Is upgrade from ver. 13 to 16 possible?

Yes.

> -> $ sudo -u postgres pg_upgrade -D /var/lib/pgsql/data/
> You must identify the directory where the old cluster binaries reside.Ple=
ase use the -b command-line option or the PGBINOLD environment variable.
> Failure, exiting
>
> Or is a restoration from a backup the only way?
>=20
> If you cannot be bothered to read the documentation for pg_upgrade, then
dump and restore may be the only way.

Yours,
Laurenz Albe





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From: Holger Jakobs <holger@jakobs.com>
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Am 02.03.26 um 15:31 schrieb Ron Johnson:
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2026 at 9:09 AM listy <listy@localities.work> wrote:
>
>     Cannot say about Debian but RHEL family (perhaps exceptions exist)
>     do not, certainly not on Centos, Ubuntu which I use, yes.
>     But also rhel/centos do not do major PGsql rel. upgrade within the
>     same/one OS release, I do not think so.
>     What happened to me - what I did rather - was upgrade from c9 to
>     c10. (not officially supported.)
>
>
> This is why I strongly urge you to use the PGDG repositories, not the 
> packages which RHEL builds.
>
> -- 
> Death to <Redacted>, and butter sauce.
> Don't boil me, I'm still alive.
> <Redacted> lobster!

Yes, RHEL doesn't take into account that PostgreSQL will ever be 
upgraded to another major version. They support the version which was 
current when they had their feature freeze for the lifetime of the system.

Therefore Ron is perfectly correct in writing that everybody should use 
the PGDG from the beginning.

You might have success installing the new version from PGDG repos and 
then run pg_upgrade (with all 4 mentioned options) from the new version. 
The preconditions for pg_upgrade are:

  * you have the old and the new software version installed (pg-13 and
    pg-18) in different directories
  * you have the old cluster unchanged and an empty new cluster in
    different directories

Maybe it helps to move the data directory of the old cluster before 
installing the new software package. Make sure you also change the path 
in the systemd service unit of the old version.

If the database isn't large, dump & restore will also work fine.

Regards,

Holger

-- 

Holger Jakobs, Bergisch Gladbach, Germany

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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 02.03.26 um 15:31 schrieb Ron
      Johnson:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CANzqJaBMxjN3eFR0hb2SmM-XzQ86jQwjvdi0eKzCb0FUx2zBQQ@mail.gmail.com">
      <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div dir="ltr">On Mon, Mar 2, 2026 at 9:09 AM listy &lt;<a
            href="mailto:listy@localities.work" moz-do-not-send="true"
            class="moz-txt-link-freetext">listy@localities.work</a>&gt;
          wrote:</div>
        <div class="gmail_quote gmail_quote_container">
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
            <div> <font size="2" face="Courier 10 Pitch">Cannot say
                about Debian but RHEL family (perhaps exceptions exist)
                do not, certainly not on Centos, Ubuntu which I use,
                yes.<br>
                But also rhel/centos do not do major PGsql rel. upgrade
                within the same/one OS release, I do not think so.<br>
                What happened to me - what I did rather - was upgrade
                from c9 to c10. (not officially supported.)</font> </div>
          </blockquote>
        </div>
        <div><br clear="all">
        </div>
        <div>This is why I strongly urge you to use the PGDG
          repositories, not the packages which RHEL builds.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <span class="gmail_signature_prefix">-- </span><br>
        <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature">
          <div dir="ltr">Death to &lt;Redacted&gt;, and butter sauce.
            <div>Don't boil me, I'm still alive.<br>
              <div>
                <div>&lt;Redacted&gt; lobster!</div>
              </div>
            </div>
          </div>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <p>Yes, RHEL doesn't take into account that PostgreSQL will ever be
      upgraded to another major version. They support the version which
      was current when they had their feature freeze for the lifetime of
      the system.</p>
    <p>Therefore Ron is perfectly correct in writing that everybody
      should use the PGDG from the beginning.</p>
    <p>You might have success installing the new version from PGDG repos
      and then run pg_upgrade (with all 4 mentioned options) from the
      new version. The preconditions for pg_upgrade are:</p>
    <ul>
      <li>you have the old and the new software version installed (pg-13
        and pg-18) in different directories</li>
      <li>you have the old cluster unchanged and an empty new cluster in
        different directories</li>
    </ul>
    <p>Maybe it helps to move the data directory of the old cluster
      before installing the new software package. Make sure you also
      change the path in the systemd service unit of the old version.</p>
    <p>If the database isn't large, dump &amp; restore will also work
      fine.</p>
    <p>Regards,</p>
    <p>Holger</p>
    <div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
      <p>Holger Jakobs, Bergisch Gladbach, Germany</p>
    </div>
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