X-Original-To: pgsql-hackers-postgresql.org@localhost.postgresql.org Received: from localhost (av.hub.org [200.46.204.144]) by postgresql.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EB089DC9D9 for ; Wed, 4 Jan 2006 03:39:21 -0400 (AST) Received: from postgresql.org ([200.46.204.71]) by localhost (av.hub.org [200.46.204.144]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 51347-07 for ; Wed, 4 Jan 2006 03:39:20 -0400 (AST) X-Greylist: from auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey- Received: from mail.leadership-solutions.net (unknown [64.90.195.136]) by postgresql.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 189EF9DC814 for ; Wed, 4 Jan 2006 03:39:16 -0400 (AST) Received: (qmail 8122 invoked by uid 1011); 4 Jan 2006 00:38:50 -0700 Received: from 67.107.200.55 by blackmamba.leadership-solutions.net (envelope-from , uid 1010) with qmail-scanner-1.24-st-qms (clamdscan: 0.80/609. spamassassin: 3.0.1. perlscan: 1.24-st-qms. Clear:RC:0(67.107.200.55):SA:0(-2.6/1.0):. Processed in 0.441212 secs); 04 Jan 2006 07:38:50 -0000 X-Antivirus-MYDOMAIN-Mail-From: rick@alpinenetworking.com via blackmamba.leadership-solutions.net X-Antivirus-MYDOMAIN: 1.24-st-qms (Clear:RC:0(67.107.200.55):SA:0(-2.6/1.0):. Processed in 0.441212 secs Process 8075) Received: from 67.107.200.55.ptr.us.xo.net (HELO ?192.168.0.90?) (rgigger%leadership-solutions.net@67.107.200.55) by mail.leadership-solutions.net with SMTP; 4 Jan 2006 00:38:50 -0700 In-Reply-To: <1135949737.5052.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200512261846.jBQIkcN12733@candle.pha.pa.us> <1135949737.5052.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v746.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <668D22FC-25AD-44E9-B68E-2BD3D2A99AC1@alpinenetworking.com> Cc: Bruce Momjian , Tom Lane , PostgreSQL-development , PostgreSQL-documentation Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rick Gigger Subject: Re: [DOCS] Online backup vs Continuous backup Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 00:42:01 -0700 To: Simon Riggs X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.746.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at hub.org X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.02 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.020] X-Spam-Score: 0.02 X-Spam-Level: X-Archive-Number: 200601/147 X-Sequence-Number: 78251 > I think it would all make more sense if we described the use of > archive_command = something as being in "WAL Archive Mode". That would > then allow us to say: > "You can only take Online Backups while in WAL Archive Mode". > "If you ever wish to perform PITR, you must use WAL Archive Mode". > "If you backed-up in WAL Archive Mode, you can perform an Archive > Recovery". It seems to me there are two different context in which one would be making statements like this. And what we are "allowed to say" depends greatly on context. These contexts are as follows: 1) Explaining the feature set of postgres to a potential user. 2) Explaining to an actual postgres user how to actually do something. In the first case it makes the most sense to me to use industry standard or very intuitive terminology to the extend that it exists. ie (Transaction Logs vs. WAL). Incremental Backup and Point in Time Recovery seem to be fairly commonly used and understood database buzzwords for someone to investigate the feature set of an RDBMS. In the second case it seems to me that the most important thing is that you pick terminology that is consistent, unambiguous and clearly defined. Log archival, PITR, etc are not point and click operations like they are in say MS SQL Server. This gives us more flexibility but it also requires a deeper understanding. If someone is unwilling or unable to to learn whatever terminology you happen to come up with then it seems to me they shouldn't even be attempting to set up one of those features. At the same time if the terminology you uses changes all the time (is not consistent), or if you can't figure out what any of the terms mean (they are not clearly defined) or if you use terms like "online backup" to mean both types of backup but then use it once in a specific circumstance where only one usage is appropriate (you are using the terms ambiguously) then users will be confused and it will be your fault not theirs. Just my 2 cents Rick Gigger