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help / color / mirror / Atom feedFrom: Alena Rybakina <[email protected]>
To: Peter Geoghegan <[email protected]>
Cc: Marcos Pegoraro <[email protected]>
Cc: Alena Rybakina <[email protected]>
Cc: Andrey Lepikhov <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected]
Cc: [email protected]
Cc: Ranier Vilela <[email protected]>
Cc: Tomas Vondra <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: POC, WIP: OR-clause support for indexes
Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2023 01:30:00 +0300
Message-ID: <[email protected]> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAH2-Wzm-W7KYtMQ_3F1zU3Fg0zhRd-kASuOzNewXEWjR5kZrtg@mail.gmail.com>
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Hi!
On 26.07.2023 02:47, Peter Geoghegan wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 2:32 AM Alena Rybakina <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Hi! I'm sorry I didn't answer you right away, I was too busy with work.
> Same for me, this time. I was busy working on my patch, which I
> finally posted yesterday.
I'm glad to hear it, I've seen your thread ("Optimizing nbtree
ScalarArrayOp execution, allowing multi-column ordered scans, skip
scan"), but, unfortunately, I didn't have enough time to read it. I'll
review it soon!
>> To be honest, I didn't think about the fact that my optimization can help eliminate duplicates before reading the data before.
> I'm not surprised that you didn't specifically think of that, because
> it's very subtle.
>
>> I am still only in the process of familiarizing myself with the thread [1] (reference from your letter), but I have already seen that there are problems related, for example, to when "or" expressions refer to the parent element.
> I didn't intend to imply that you might have the same problem here. I
> just meant that OR optimizations can have problems with duplicate
> elimination, in general. I suspect that your patch doesn't have that
> problem, because you are performing a transformation of one kind of OR
> into another kind of OR.
Yes, you are right, but I studied this topic and two other sources to
accumulate my knowledge. It was an exciting experience for me)
I was especially inspired after studying the interview with Goetz Graf
[2], his life experience is the most inspiring, and from this article I
was able to get a broad understanding of the field of databases:
current problems, future development, how it works... Thank you for the
recommendation.
I discovered for myself that the idea described in the article [1] is
similar to the idea of representing grouped data in OLAP cubes, and
also, if I saw correctly, an algorithm like depth-first search is used
there, but for indexes.
I think it really helps to speed up the search with similar deep
filtering compared to cluster indexes, but do we have cases where we
don't use this algorithm because it takes longer than an usual index?
I thought about the situation with wide indexes (with a lot of multiple
columns) and having a lot of filtering predicates for them.
But I'm not sure about this, so it seems to me that this is a problem of
improper use of indexes rather.
>> I think, I would face the similar problems if I complicate the current code, for example, so that not only or expressions standing on the same level are written in any, but also on different ones without violating the logic of the priority of executing operators.
> I can't say that I am particularly experienced in this general area --
> I have never tried to formally reason about how two different
> statements are equivalent. It just hasn't been something that I've
> needed to have a totally rigorous understanding of up until now. But
> my recent patch changes that. Now I need to study this area to make
> sure that I have a truly rigorous understanding.
>
> Jeff Davis suggested that I read "Logic and Databases", by C.J. Date.
> So now I have some homework to do.
I'll read this book too. Maybe I can finish work with the knowledge I
got from there. Thank you for sharing!
>> Unfortunately, when I tried to make a transformation at the stage of index formation, I encountered too incorrect an assessment of the selectivity of relation, which affected the incorrect calculation of the cost and cardinality.
> It's not surprising that a weird shift in the plan chosen by the
> optimizer is seen with some random test case, as a result of this
> added transformation. Even changes that are 100% strictly better (e.g.
> changes in a selectivity estimation function that is somehow
> guaranteed to be more accurate in all cases) might do that. Here is a
> recent example of that with another patch, involving a bitmap OR:
>
> https://postgr.es/m/CAH2-WznCDK9n2tZ6j_-iLN563_ePuC3NzP6VSVTL6jHzs6nRuQ@mail.gmail.com
At first, this surprised me very much. It took time to find a suitable
place to implement the transformation.
I have looked through this thread many times, I will study it in more
detail .
> This example was *not* a regression, if you go by conventional
> measures. It was merely a less robust plan than the bitmap OR plan,
> because it didn't pass down both columns as index quals.
>
> BTW, there are various restrictions on the sort order of SAOPs that
> you might want to try to familiarize yourself with. I describe them
> (perhaps not very clearly) here:
>
> https://postgr.es/m/CAH2-Wz=ksvN_sjcnD1+Bt-WtifRA5ok48aDYnq3pkKhxgMQpcw@mail.gmail.com
Thank you! Yes, I'll study it too)
> Currently, the optimizer doesn't recognize multi-column indexes with
> SAOPs on every column as having a valid sort order, except on the
> first column. It seems possible that that has consequences for your
> patch. (I'm really only guessing, though; don't trust anything that I
> say about the optimizer too much.)
>
Honestly, I couldn't understand your concerns very well, could you
describe it in more detail?
1. https://vldb.org/conf/1995/P710.PDF
2.
https://sigmodrecord.org/publications/sigmodRecord/2009/pdfs/05_Profiles_Graefe.pdf
--
Regards,
Alena Rybakina
Postgres Professional
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Subject: Re: POC, WIP: OR-clause support for indexes
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