Received: from magus.postgresql.org (magus.postgresql.org [87.238.57.229]) by mail.postgresql.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7C0415A7DE0 for ; Fri, 13 Apr 2012 05:56:31 -0300 (ADT) Received: from acidenitrix.villemain.org ([91.121.90.165]) by magus.postgresql.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1SIcIu-0002Sv-Gf for pgsql-hackers@postgresql.org; Fri, 13 Apr 2012 08:56:30 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=dim) by acidenitrix.villemain.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1SIcIh-0003PU-2d; Fri, 13 Apr 2012 10:56:15 +0200 Received: by dim (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 8721740F68; Fri, 13 Apr 2012 10:55:51 +0200 (CEST) From: Dimitri Fontaine To: Robert Haas Cc: Andres Freund , pgsql-hackers@postgresql.org, Greg Smith Subject: Re: Last gasp Organization: 2ndQuadrant References: <4F84D3A0.8010808@2ndQuadrant.com> <201204110332.05789.andres@anarazel.de> User-Mail-Address: dimitri@2ndQuadrant.fr Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2012 10:55:51 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Robert Haas's message of "Tue, 10 Apr 2012 22:31:26 -0400") Message-ID: <87bomwt3hk.fsf@hi-media-techno.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110018 (No Gnus v0.18) Emacs/24.0.94 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Pg-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) X-Archive-Number: 201204/666 X-Sequence-Number: 206469 Robert Haas writes: > The real problem with the command triggers patch is that we got a > blizzard of code. It's unrealistic to expect anyone to devote serious > review time to a patch that's under constant development. It also > strikes me that a tremendous amount of pain could have been avoided by > posting a clear and detailed design sketch for that patch before > beginning to code. Dimitri contended that without code, no one will > read design sketches, but that doesn't for the most part jive with my > experience, and I think that the strategy he actually chose backfired, > because it was clear that any review would be hitting a moving target. In my mind at least it's been more subtle. I had an agreed-on design months before I started to code anything, at the Cluster Hackers Meeting in Ottawa, where several commiters and long term contributors have been participating in the discussion. The big mistake seems to be starting to code with that rather than spending another couple of months (or easily way more than that) of rehashing it on-list. About the design sketches, IME, what you can agree on on-list is a very high level view about how to implement a feature, anything detailed enough to have practical impact on the code you're writing happens while reviewing code. Again, as I though the high level view was ok as of the Cluster Hackers Meeting, I skipped that part and went directly to the code level review. Greg Smith will certainly stamp that email with a big red =E2=80=9CLesson Learned=E2=80=9D stamp here: nothing happened if you don't have a link to a pgsql-hackers thread on the archives. Regards, --=20 Dimitri Fontaine http://2ndQuadrant.fr PostgreSQL : Expertise, Formation et Support