Received: from malur.postgresql.org ([217.196.149.56]) by arkaria.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nFh41-0007P8-Kz for pgsql-hackers@arkaria.postgresql.org; Thu, 03 Feb 2022 18:42:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=malur.postgresql.org) by malur.postgresql.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nFh40-0006V2-FK for pgsql-hackers@arkaria.postgresql.org; Thu, 03 Feb 2022 18:42:36 +0000 Received: from magus.postgresql.org ([2a02:c0:301:0:ffff::29]) by malur.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nFh40-0006Ut-3S for pgsql-hackers@lists.postgresql.org; Thu, 03 Feb 2022 18:42:36 +0000 Received: from mail-lf1-x130.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::130]) by magus.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nFh3w-0004gb-No for pgsql-hackers@lists.postgresql.org; Thu, 03 Feb 2022 18:42:35 +0000 Received: by mail-lf1-x130.google.com with SMTP id f10so7836480lfu.8 for ; Thu, 03 Feb 2022 10:42:32 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=0L9eQXfPluvNBGifatKTizhkM9Hd3aKH3EGRVWIsBD0=; b=eLDAkvuEDNA4a9PPh0OsrdtBnyY6g+sshdHYaThVxGANw5HBHRH1E8HTVXcNJqM4D+ WPuc+XE4Bbo/nEObBifDFM6Pmyhj0P52vXtOQJvNE1zr7kTcee3AKaIoFgG2hSVaJ0OZ XPBOWeTQy44OjQ9c1snn5iHP+cFrzgJ9G/wR1V8a0bl0gw0Gmm6dCIUv93hN1Av8TBRk Z/xGSWKxQgYLhkuBS3uH8O/2FRTQo9QhWWDV9H0/fkASQl2p9LFqb0WonsOFiyjs7gms FwznQzUa3cYFOwdClRufzefXMmSz4j5q6is7gvjShOcbZ9KUEZcnsel+wYH6/d/AXfu7 M9RQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=0L9eQXfPluvNBGifatKTizhkM9Hd3aKH3EGRVWIsBD0=; b=JVISr2GLyBv5LqoZD5sSog2Gh1T3R2CScVyU0wFV2tm5VFDgmgyqjzGY7J8pwMFLRe 8VwNTeTVmzAroYKPoNUPpW1qjbZqcR4QXHwgq0ar+O53BJlwqW75U8PwAq3hoJWRWfLs I5PWrRT3yCqFDINY1IzJiuCMlDF/dTMYOkfsgXbptYE+QZr2wsP0gmGHv4rtIvO8Dphg FsXE5/pI89JsGGkGr1IbtLlpMFJ7wdhqJtD6IBjeU/gM3mMxBgv1aSoGX4h3OgC9x5hQ ++SktYPjyngl0Fv2M04QyN9HdgRkj+hn1qRVHrJvD9CIP8ZQi211st2ES1o3GR3lwDNc 3XjQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533IByMOEyeqVxOl0VExXWpMF+XbW2ykK1peQIE+1iw0Dr3Lj5K6 6lvquKUQkV1fqxoD+7BI1bqFSd/UzTbtuZ+wjJs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwo/n7SPaRn/vLE3H31quJvs2PRuPtzQ0ek3iziKRJm6Zv1TvmYIphEi6dzrPC6CabSgk/RrCqR5CsA/NmBaic= X-Received: by 2002:a19:7512:: with SMTP id y18mr28401625lfe.368.1643913751876; Thu, 03 Feb 2022 10:42:31 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20211210015616.o242b4xchhpglfcy@alap3.anarazel.de> In-Reply-To: From: Robert Haas Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2022 13:42:20 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: do only critical work during single-user vacuum? To: John Naylor Cc: Andres Freund , Peter Geoghegan , PostgreSQL Hackers Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" List-Id: List-Help: List-Subscribe: List-Post: List-Owner: List-Archive: Archived-At: Precedence: bulk On Thu, Feb 3, 2022 at 1:34 PM John Naylor wrote: > The word "advice" sounds like people have a choice, rather than the > system not accepting commands anymore. It would be much less painful > if the system closed connections and forbade all but superusers to > connect, but that sounds like a lot of work. (happy to be proven > otherwise) They *do* have a choice. They can continue to operate the system in multi-user mode, they can have read access to their data, and they can run VACUUM and other non-XID-allocating commands to fix the issue. Sure, their application can't run commands that allocate XIDs, but it's not going to be able to do that if they go to single-user mode either. I don't understand why we would want the system to stop accepting connections other than superuser connections. That would provide strictly less functionality and I don't understand what it would gain. But it would still be better than going into single-user mode, which provides even less functionality and has basically no advantages of any kind. Why are you convinced that the user HAS to go to single-user mode? I don't think they have to do that, and I don't think they should want to do that. -- Robert Haas EDB: http://www.enterprisedb.com