Received: from malur.postgresql.org ([217.196.149.56]) by arkaria.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1rnfbY-00ERl4-SK for pgsql-hackers@arkaria.postgresql.org; Fri, 22 Mar 2024 14:10:45 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=malur.postgresql.org) by malur.postgresql.org with esmtp (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1rnfbX-003wmO-CA for pgsql-hackers@arkaria.postgresql.org; Fri, 22 Mar 2024 14:10:43 +0000 Received: from magus.postgresql.org ([2a02:c0:301:0:ffff::29]) by malur.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1rnfbX-003wmG-2z for pgsql-hackers@lists.postgresql.org; Fri, 22 Mar 2024 14:10:43 +0000 Received: from mail-ej1-x634.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::634]) by magus.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1rnfbQ-005up9-Fs for pgsql-hackers@postgresql.org; Fri, 22 Mar 2024 14:10:42 +0000 Received: by mail-ej1-x634.google.com with SMTP id a640c23a62f3a-a46ea03c2a5so380620766b.1 for ; Fri, 22 Mar 2024 07:10:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1711116635; x=1711721435; darn=postgresql.org; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=hsC+tsgLbX4Hj9Lgg+v8qCgDEZY0FD7qMD4H2EQtltg=; b=Tx2f7iGmnVhlq4Y3yAunvxc8ZdaLhgnTIeNXy+8kTEz4lLLw9n0JB6tCp1TP734CCU iVmVxfClR62H66VkPxNRhW32fJpBzfbVsemXB6+Xobvu6/5pK3gRc4BFp/2B1VIP96gd taGKbc87AHsEjXEfMfIhUfXnQDMc0Z6fRQ3/s4soYjxUqmzs+lmGzr2YvmJdulSQ2sUY RqUmY+NyffPrnCg0ECvQaTDjUhXbf77B+3wtmhFYRkUTDIDxdgdZ4scNBx2RzVoVW0i8 djV4DKc4sAH9UFefp702gEHpoHzAmeamvfX42NUxbLb62p9ad0cRzwrHh3wt2cnmGvdv 5vHA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1711116635; x=1711721435; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=hsC+tsgLbX4Hj9Lgg+v8qCgDEZY0FD7qMD4H2EQtltg=; b=FjQYn3kznpNOYILZoVtlr4G3LGqT4XmfI26qlYAwam8G0ubrDKU2rCb49+qMC2MtRn LyuOXxYrRVKy51ptYf/G6XAiyG6h59oUChSa93puMGFuHYrtEvi/TdUmb3ZNE4GzQtKB 1O64wK3Hp00XikIAQD6VDS8fcT3pNP3UWKKm3czALhG+WcXLE53TvGP0UpIcXeRmEXEJ VMUq/dSb26AxKawtVNAZb85D/bOk+x1mzWLNEZ5YMuUc6e9Cf23L8Ch3bfgpsOAbob4+ V25i8WVtZ5kUp8oOJ4MXaKsMP+WhayASiJu9M9ooHjDg3b9UeN+c6b6ylL8EQ9qWd00n JKJw== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCUk+a3Fw2hAoquZZ0BQsPogHqNa3p24IVIMrORqdo0WP2lLMnvty1Ppc7xpaGjJVevCZYLnEmx302VX4pLf8Kr2ujRzpVTqrN99Ah+z X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YysKuCCylU4fwuTuwTV6gHzA1f/vcfMY8vs081sVu60VE6MELRb 58ypmwiIUKb2QfNTWEAgDGxjyibMXC/VfJyZPzfhxWhGnYhzHtfk6J5wmXAn4+uWaU2BemKZSVZ 7k/BWsoz/ng+mqbV17kYt6fH7u4U= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEvG3gxpsa7fCBTo1dd8CJthwVhjSMKBcFFNFK9jAPcT8SVyNSwZt3u6lr17ouFphAggSrrV5ndeF/74FNryrc= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:154f:b0:a46:9f12:ca2a with SMTP id c15-20020a170906154f00b00a469f12ca2amr1710148ejd.22.1711116635198; Fri, 22 Mar 2024 07:10:35 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <33e82e2a-3954-4c1e-8114-ffbd8dfb5293@eisentraut.org> In-Reply-To: <33e82e2a-3954-4c1e-8114-ffbd8dfb5293@eisentraut.org> From: Robert Haas Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2024 10:10:22 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: documentation structure To: Peter Eisentraut Cc: Andrew Dunstan , "pgsql-hackers@postgresql.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable List-Id: List-Help: List-Subscribe: List-Post: List-Owner: List-Archive: Archived-At: Precedence: bulk On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 9:35=E2=80=AFAM Peter Eisentraut wrote: > >> But this separation was explicitly added a few years ago, because most > >> people just want to read about the binaries. > > > > I really doubt that this is true. > > Here is the thread: > https://www.postgresql.org/message-id/flat/CABUevExRCf8waYOsrCO-QxQL50XGa= pMf5dnWScOXj7X%3DMXW--g%40mail.gmail.com Sorry. I didn't mean to dispute the point that the section was added a few years ago, nor the point that most people just want to read about the binaries. I am confident that both of those things are true. What I do want to dispute is that having a four-sentence chapter in the documentation index that tells people something they can find much more easily without using the documentation at all is a good plan. I agree with the concern that Magnus expressed on the thread, i.e: > It's kind of strange that if you start your PostgreSQL journey by reading= our instructions, you get nothing useful about installing PostgreSQL from = binary packages other than "go ask somebody else about it". But I don't agree that this was the right way to address that problem. I think it would have been better to just add the download link to the existing installation chapter. That's actually what we had in chapter 18, "Installation from Source Code on Windows", since removed. But for some reason we decided that on non-Windows platforms, it needed a whole new chapter rather than an extra sentence in the existing one. I think that's massively overkill. Alternately, I think it would be reasonable to address the concern by just moving all the stuff about building from source code to an appendix, and assume people can figure out how to download the software without us needing to say anything in the documentation at all. What was weird about the state before that patch, IMHO, was that we both talked about building from source code and didn't talk about binary packages. That can be addressed either by adding a mention of binary packages, or by deemphasizing the idea of installing from source code. --=20 Robert Haas EDB: http://www.enterprisedb.com