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From: "David G. Johnston" <david.g.johnston@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2026 07:47:35 -0700
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 <CAKFQuwY8Fm_JdXQUvEX5KGXbfLh3onZeFj9ZPEL9aB88wT7aQA@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: PG 19 release notes and authors
To: =?UTF-8?Q?=C3=81lvaro_Herrera?= <alvherre@kurilemu.de>
Cc: Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>, Peter Geoghegan <pg@bowt.ie>,
 Andrey Borodin <x4mmm@yandex-team.ru>,
	PostgreSQL-development <pgsql-hackers@lists.postgresql.org>
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On Sunday, April 5, 2026, =C3=81lvaro Herrera <alvherre@kurilemu.de> wrote:

> On 2026-Apr-05, Bruce Momjian wrote:
>
> > I just updated the wiki to handle this case because obviously
> > Co-authored-by is listing more than just committers:
> >
> >       https://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/Commit_Message_Guidance#Ta
> gs%3A_%22%3A%22
> >       Used to indicate the patch authors. "Co-authored-by:" should list
> >       individuals who modified the patch but should not be listed as
> >       authors in the release notes.
>
> I don't see in what way this is useful.  Why do you want to suppress
> people from getting credit for the work they do?  Having changed the
> commit guidance this way, I think no committer would use Co-authored-by
> at all.


The ambiguity is whether the committer is an author.  We can either say
committers are not/never implicitly authors so if the committer needs to be
made the/an author they add themselves using an author or co-author line.
Or we let them be implicitly an author if there is no actual author
credited.  In which case co-author lines are needed because the author line
cannot be used.  Regardless, a co-author is always an author - it=E2=80=99s=
 in the
title - and should be listed any place authorship is listed.  The existing
guidance for Author is implicit for the committer.  If there is a real
author noted the committer is not automatically an author.  Whether we=E2=
=80=99ve
used author+co-author or multiple author lines is immaterial, they
communicate the same basic thing (committer is not an author, and there are
more than one author), at a high level, today.  Maybe in the future we=E2=
=80=99d
try to distinguish them in practice, but that hasn=E2=80=99t happened in an=
y way
that matters today.

No author, no co-author: committer is sole author
Author+(author and/or co-author)s: committer is not an author, all others
are
Only co-authors: committer is author, as are the co-author(s)


> > I am not sure PG 19 follows this, but we might want to follow it going
> > forward.
>
> More and more I am getting the feeling that the commit guidance is
> actually misguided.  The document itself is not very good (I mean, why
> use XML-lookalike to represent a commit message, which is regular
> English prose??); and I don't feel it represents actual consensus.
>
> > A larger issue is that since we now have links to the commits in the
> > release notes, there might no longer be a need to list _any_ names next
> > to the release note items.
>
> I don't understand your motivation for saying things like these.
>

I was under the impression this aspect of producing the release notes is
scripted, in which case I do think it is valuable enough to continue
doing.  I do think we have enough structured data that if we felt our
attribution efforts were insufficient there are more things we could do.
I=E2=80=99m not sure this is the most valuable way to expose this data but =
it=E2=80=99s a
way, we likely don=E2=80=99t do enough promotion even with it, and it seems=
 low
maintenance.  But maybe there is a cost/benefit discussion to be had here.

David J.

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On Sunday, April 5, 2026, =C3=81lvaro Herrera &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:alvherr=
e@kurilemu.de" target=3D"_blank">alvherre@kurilemu.de</a>&gt; wrote:<br><bl=
ockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #=
ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">On 2026-Apr-05, Bruce Momjian wrote:<br>
<br>
&gt; I just updated the wiki to handle this case because obviously<br>
&gt; Co-authored-by is listing more than just committers:<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0<a href=3D"https://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/=
Commit_Message_Guidance#Tags%3A_%22%3A%22" target=3D"_blank">https://wiki.p=
ostgresql.org/w<wbr>iki/Commit_Message_Guidance#Ta<wbr>gs%3A_%22%3A%22</a><=
br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Used to indicate the patch authors. &quot;Co=
-authored-by:&quot; should list<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0individuals who modified the patch but shoul=
d not be listed as<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0authors in the release notes.<br>
<br>
I don&#39;t see in what way this is useful.=C2=A0 Why do you want to suppre=
ss<br>
people from getting credit for the work they do?=C2=A0 Having changed the<b=
r>
commit guidance this way, I think no committer would use Co-authored-by<br>
at all.</blockquote><div><br></div><div>The ambiguity is whether the commit=
ter is an author.=C2=A0 We can either say committers are not/never implicit=
ly authors so if the committer needs to be made the/an author they add them=
selves using an author or co-author line.=C2=A0 Or we let them be implicitl=
y an author if there is no actual author credited.=C2=A0 In which case co-a=
uthor lines are needed because the author line cannot be used.=C2=A0 Regard=
less, a co-author is always an author - it=E2=80=99s in the title - and sho=
uld be listed any place authorship is listed.=C2=A0 The existing guidance f=
or Author is implicit for the committer.=C2=A0 If there is a real author no=
ted the committer is not automatically an author.=C2=A0 Whether we=E2=80=99=
ve used author+co-author or multiple author lines is immaterial, they commu=
nicate the same basic thing (committer is not an author, and there are more=
 than one author), at a high level, today.=C2=A0 Maybe in the future we=E2=
=80=99d try to distinguish them in practice, but that hasn=E2=80=99t happen=
ed in any way that matters today.</div><div><br></div><div>No author, no co=
-author: committer is sole author</div><div>Author+(author and/or co-author=
)s: committer is not an author, all others are</div><div>Only co-authors: c=
ommitter is author, as are the co-author(s)</div><div><br></div><blockquote=
 class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc soli=
d;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
&gt; I am not sure PG 19 follows this, but we might want to follow it going=
<br>
&gt; forward.<br>
<br>
More and more I am getting the feeling that the commit guidance is<br>
actually misguided.=C2=A0 The document itself is not very good (I mean, why=
<br>
use XML-lookalike to represent a commit message, which is regular<br>
English prose??); and I don&#39;t feel it represents actual consensus.<br>
<br>
&gt; A larger issue is that since we now have links to the commits in the<b=
r>
&gt; release notes, there might no longer be a need to list _any_ names nex=
t<br>
&gt; to the release note items.<br>
<br>
I don&#39;t understand your motivation for saying things like these.<br>
</blockquote><div><br></div><div>I was under the impression this aspect of =
producing the release notes is scripted, in which case I do think it is val=
uable enough to continue doing.=C2=A0 I do think we have enough structured =
data that if we felt our attribution efforts were insufficient there are mo=
re things we could do.=C2=A0 I=E2=80=99m not sure this is the most valuable=
 way to expose this data but it=E2=80=99s a way, we likely don=E2=80=99t do=
 enough promotion even with it, and it seems low maintenance.=C2=A0 But may=
be there is a cost/benefit discussion to be had here.</div><div><br></div><=
div>David J.</div><div><br></div>

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