Received: from malur.postgresql.org ([217.196.149.56]) by arkaria.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1ussEG-00CH7h-TN for pgsql-hackers@arkaria.postgresql.org; Mon, 01 Sep 2025 00:17:02 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=malur.postgresql.org) by malur.postgresql.org with esmtp (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1ussEG-003F1d-08 for pgsql-hackers@arkaria.postgresql.org; Mon, 01 Sep 2025 00:17:00 +0000 Received: from makus.postgresql.org ([2001:4800:3e1:1::229]) by malur.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.3) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1ussEF-003F1V-NL for pgsql-hackers@lists.postgresql.org; Mon, 01 Sep 2025 00:17:00 +0000 Received: from fout-b1-smtp.messagingengine.com ([202.12.124.144]) by makus.postgresql.org with smtp (Exim 4.96) (envelope-from ) id 1ussED-002kfu-2D for pgsql-hackers@lists.postgresql.org; Mon, 01 Sep 2025 00:16:59 +0000 Received: from phl-compute-11.internal (phl-compute-11.internal [10.202.2.51]) by mailfout.stl.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CE811D00056; Sun, 31 Aug 2025 20:16:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from phl-mailfrontend-01 ([10.202.2.162]) by phl-compute-11.internal (MEProxy); Sun, 31 Aug 2025 20:16:57 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=paquier.xyz; h= cc:cc:content-type:content-type:date:date:from:from:in-reply-to :in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:subject :subject:to:to; s=fm1; t=1756685816; x=1756772216; bh=9Om9HISR1e LeKU1anQuiOVabLLKYCYlGDJal3QGNWDU=; b=ev1TSv0YSK2ewApbGyMzIel3fQ 32a5N/GuapxncOdMGaE7UbGgDEtL/MydEMA+pdPOpiVQSKCMbHPCWC5kFh8vBp7S blTLVatZSfGLtQGCxHGUKLVpEoL7NY7LSHg2q1fjYHDLXmWHrRTEz+M3wUxyzWAa mMf+vX0qKXhNChjFq5dIw1yTkAaUmayqcmk/ZgJMRcMl1EkmAsFZ5Z6+SEbjVNKu q0iExMStR/bK8LqK5xuhh/irJi9sFOUcTlhjfdQdl95V0RVu5cHfiDuREv5ONBbK OXgITN6m1ULlzHxY7sS/tL0VQcQVrcoq6VBMJG4ufuUa619x7iw1uLC/ZNXQ== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:cc:content-type:content-type:date:date :feedback-id:feedback-id:from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:subject:subject:to :to:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; t= 1756685816; x=1756772216; bh=9Om9HISR1eLeKU1anQuiOVabLLKYCYlGDJa l3QGNWDU=; b=OZUCT7FCQTRVoOPr4iU9pC72nlrIq6JYtQACIiZkBBHs27SxAnr UW1lfLW2wb+kCuTz32mPtdUfMrU/4Z9PFv6ILh1hkToC0YCjFaTV8hiVTr5/whk3 XzcISIy5H5E030HRBOYl/StkVQg7L+xpyATl82WWNS/McrthDF6PnMYqxGiaav3R WjcmScs2TgSI1PUqU1OTN+k0t+Jb43Qqyg1qL7/1Tupt1OeEm8rOIVew5qbnqJMn pP8dknYrjUM8zQujRU1mx/Ksv6LbliF69T/7PREF8QxL+F5ZdshTlKBbtC+ZL1Wa f5xWmzywxgNzKUeR3M0OBiNx8vnmHNp/tTg== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Received: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeeffedrtdefgdduledtieekucetufdoteggodetrf dotffvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceu rghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmnegfrh hlucfvnfffucdljedtmdenucfjughrpeffhffvvefukfhfgggtuggjsehgtderredttddv necuhfhrohhmpefoihgthhgrvghlucfrrghquhhivghruceomhhitghhrggvlhesphgrqh huihgvrhdrgiihiieqnecuggftrfgrthhtvghrnhepteelieefudffhffhtdetleeggeeg fffhkeeuveetiefgudduvedutefggeeivdejnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenuc frrghrrghmpehmrghilhhfrhhomhepmhhitghhrggvlhesphgrqhhuihgvrhdrgiihiidp nhgspghrtghpthhtohepiedpmhhouggvpehsmhhtphhouhhtpdhrtghpthhtohepmhhihh grihhlnhhikhgrlhgrhigvuhesghhmrghilhdrtghomhdprhgtphhtthhopegrhhestgih sggvrhhtvggtrdgrthdprhgtphhtthhopegrlhhvhhgvrhhrvgesrghlvhhhrdhnohdqih hprdhorhhgpdhrtghpthhtohepmhgrshgrohdrfhhujhhiihesghhmrghilhdrtghomhdp rhgtphhtthhopehrohgsseigiihilhhlrgdrnhgvthdprhgtphhtthhopehpghhsqhhlqd hhrggtkhgvrhhssehlihhsthhsrdhpohhsthhgrhgvshhqlhdrohhrgh X-ME-Proxy: Feedback-ID: i0fe9450f:Fastmail Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Sun, 31 Aug 2025 20:16:54 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 1 Sep 2025 09:16:42 +0900 From: Michael Paquier To: Mihail Nikalayeu Cc: Antonin Houska , Alvaro Herrera , Fujii Masao , Robert Treat , Pg Hackers Subject: Re: Adding REPACK [concurrently] Message-ID: References: <21931.1756136535@localhost> <24483.1756142534@localhost> <4790.1756197960@localhost> <29527.1756215093@localhost> <6931.1756275367@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="T9gKxy12nYPXt7rf" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: List-Id: List-Help: List-Subscribe: List-Post: List-Owner: List-Archive: Archived-At: Precedence: bulk --T9gKxy12nYPXt7rf Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline On Wed, Aug 27, 2025 at 10:22:24AM +0200, Mihail Nikalayeu wrote: > That worries me - it is not the behaviour someone expects from a > database by default. At least the warning should be much more visible > and obvious. > I think most of user will expect the same guarantees as [CREATE|RE] > INDEX CONCURRENTLY provides. Having a unified path for the handling of the waits and the locking sounds to me like a pretty good argument in favor of a basic implementation. In my experience, users do not really care about the time it takes to complete a operation involving CONCURRENTLY if we allow concurrent reads and writes in parallel of it. I have not looked at the proposal in details, but before trying a more folkloric MVCC approach, relying on basics that we know have been working for some time seems like a good and sufficient initial step in terms of handling the waits and the locks with table AMs (aka heap or something else). Just my 2c. -- Michael --T9gKxy12nYPXt7rf Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCgAdFiEEG72nH6vTowiyblFKnvQgOdbyQH0FAmi05eoACgkQnvQgOdby QH1pnA//dqPmw8Eam1CYKSVIRkZtkZvYmbtLI48T6yp38vJvsPQk3MLdCkwHZcRE IgDyT5vKN/m4P+2rldBoWubV6Zf5Ov9+t1/WTCNuwep1wvXGEkS0eW2jsSINIDJO Qt3ZMNc3NEc6Lui8Cj3Q5LXs7iQByVwwEpDZQI+figlfLa5fs2I/EeU1UVRaZV8k YSQpgD+6G5eZ4MNDL9eqEfC9IFuxh6Pcu5o0oFFodCpZTwL1kX1NGonBiw0jFRL8 6K60m7mwY1d0D/K3FQ8WWnp1B+xEk2+siFbVS/I5mzeB4fL3++RiUUrPrFTwuBxf htXlYT4zNGZI5t37WkK8j11hZb0F/SpWgC+fqnvjAqHgysdOC0eQubl9vRM9s9Mt A9+A49uvqRtV8FHQnepZ7iq9lBGhtZiuJELpwUSairDG0ST9ROgQHcIhHAtMxYSZ 3YBlj7LCb//27hUHGiGfjUMaeEnwLMldNNDBWIeva8cFg0ELqF8Zm0zZ5pREKTs0 REGTMpbcf7gMFEHn0oQYEra0Cs+/JceX0G1sIU89+ueXNM2vbbwcLFlpGOnEUfsI yGJtXvMU4s30idjjvQvqnv/wedNdf9J83rK1DV/36BcOk5RutIeP+L7RXxR4rAo0 SGm80FDBYjxRQMT+eiuJnRN014vwdFNuDXNOF6/eQGfKyNb7WTo= =hbS9 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --T9gKxy12nYPXt7rf--