Received: from localhost (unknown [200.46.204.183]) by postgresql.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFD9565014A for ; Fri, 17 Oct 2008 05:00:22 -0300 (ADT) Received: from postgresql.org ([200.46.204.86]) by localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.204.183]) (amavisd-maia, port 10024) with ESMTP id 84446-10 for ; Fri, 17 Oct 2008 05:00:12 -0300 (ADT) X-Greylist: from auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from hapkido.dreamhost.com (hapkido.dreamhost.com [66.33.216.122]) by postgresql.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB29865019C for ; Fri, 17 Oct 2008 05:00:10 -0300 (ADT) Received: from postalmail-a5.g.dreamhost.com (sd-green-bigip-177.dreamhost.com [208.97.132.177]) by hapkido.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4B9E17A47F for ; Fri, 17 Oct 2008 01:00:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Barak.fort.loc (0x57372ee2.mrbnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk [87.55.46.226]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by postalmail-a5.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 281C3BE95B for ; Fri, 17 Oct 2008 00:59:58 -0700 (PDT) Resent-To: pgsql-general@postgresql.org From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Mikkel_H=F8gh?= To: Scott Marlowe In-Reply-To: Resent-From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Mikkel_H=F8gh?= Subject: Re: Drupal and PostgreSQL - performance issues? References: <7438A981-4B6A-4E5A-A1E0-50432CDEFB00@hoegh.org> <48F6EE94.8010904@batory.org.pl> <4BE94DFB-8917-4175-9083-7DEABC30BD7F@hoegh.org> <48F70157.7010601@batory.org.pl> <20081016144046.GH4452@tamriel.snowman.net> <10268b3e0810160809l3f16fba3k1d45271fbbe865b@mail.gmail.com> <20081016152647.GI4452@tamriel.snowman.net> Message-Id: <4F39EAE4-2C57-4839-8AB7-98AC131C0C4A@hoegh.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Apple-Mail-1--1037551574; micalg=sha1; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature" Resent-Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 09:57:47 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 23:17:35 +0200 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Resent-Message-Id: <20081017075958.281C3BE95B@postalmail-a5.g.dreamhost.com> X-Virus-Scanned: Maia Mailguard 1.0.1 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0 tagged_above=0 required=5 tests=none X-Spam-Level: X-Archive-Number: 200810/732 X-Sequence-Number: 138981 --Apple-Mail-1--1037551574 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 16/10/2008, at 18.27, Scott Marlowe wrote: > On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 9:26 AM, Stephen Frost > wrote: >> * DelGurth (delgurth@gmail.com) wrote: >>> Seems Tomasz linked to the wrong patch. The patch he meant was: >>> http://drupal.org/files/issues/drupal_lookup_path-6.x.patch.txt >> >> That's much better. >> >>> Also nice to see people "benchmark" differences by just executing a >>> query once[2][3].... >> >> This thread is insane.. Is every change to drupal run through this >> kind >> of design-by-committee? And the paranoia of a cost difference of >> 0.09ms >> for something which ends up getting cached for one particular storage >> engine under one particular database?! >> >> Makes me worried about drupal's future, heh. > > In all fairness, pgsql goes through the same kind of design by > committee process. We just have a committee of very smart people > hashing things out. Well, I think it's a general weak spot of almost all CMS projects. They are all run by programmers, not DBAs. In our case, it's PHP people excel at, (sadly) not *SQL. That's a trend I've seen a lot with web developers. They like to program, and the database is usually abstracted away as much as possible, to avoid having to write your own queries. That is, at least, the picture I'm seeing. PHP PDO, ActiveRecord, SQLAlchemy, Django DB, Hibernate. Not all of these are equally bad, but the main reason these are so popular is that then you don't have to write SQL. So, we have a lot of otherwise proficient programmers who couldn't SQL their way out a phone booth. Sigh. P.S.: Why are e-mails from this list not sent with a Reply-To: header of the lists e-mail-address? --Apple-Mail-1--1037551574 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIFdjCCBXIw ggRaoAMCAQICBEVzyswwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwMTELMAkGA1UEBhMCREsxDDAKBgNVBAoTA1RE QzEUMBIGA1UEAxMLVERDIE9DRVMgQ0EwHhcNMDgwNDE3MDgzMjQ2WhcNMTAwNDE3MDkwMjQ2WjB8 MQswCQYDVQQGEwJESzEpMCcGA1UEChMgSW5nZW4gb3JnYW5pc2F0b3Jpc2sgdGlsa255dG5pbmcx QjAbBgNVBAMUFE1pa2tlbCBUaG9zdHJ1cCBI+GdoMCMGA1UEBRMcUElEOjkyMDgtMjAwMi0yLTM3 MTk0MDU1NDQyODCBnzANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQEFAAOBjQAwgYkCgYEAtI+nfJ78bdYusbm3hxYgYdsN 3qPmIaHtfL3G/KdaZBScdD/ByCFMmoL4iQ4QUV5ZjgEki/LMngP71l5ESsceUfMgU7VhU2O6CJFC VgGAMgrUO+FEuiso97hbL6Ywkh8C7b3YsXukA3mDBMHSINqDlrq0AJ5zzU852eSFED9C5YkCAwEA AaOCAskwggLFMA4GA1UdDwEB/wQEAwID+DArBgNVHRAEJDAigA8yMDA4MDQxNzA4MzI0NlqBDzIw MTAwNDE3MDkwMjQ2WjCCATcGA1UdIASCAS4wggEqMIIBJgYKKoFQgSkBAQEBAzCCARYwLwYIKwYB BQUHAgEWI2h0dHA6Ly93d3cuY2VydGlmaWthdC5kay9yZXBvc2l0b3J5MIHiBggrBgEFBQcCAjCB 1TAKFgNUREMwAwIBARqBxkZvciBhbnZlbmRlbHNlIGFmIGNlcnRpZmlrYXRldCBn5mxkZXIgT0NF UyB2aWxr5XIsIENQUyBvZyBPQ0VTIENQLCBkZXIga2FuIGhlbnRlcyBmcmEgd3d3LmNlcnRpZmlr YXQuZGsvcmVwb3NpdG9yeS4gQmVt5nJrLCBhdCBUREMgZWZ0ZXIgdmlsa+VyZW5lIGhhciBldCBi ZWdy5m5zZXQgYW5zdmFyIGlmdC4gcHJvZmVzc2lvbmVsbGUgcGFydGVyLjBBBggrBgEFBQcBAQQ1 MDMwMQYIKwYBBQUHMAGGJWh0dHA6Ly9vY3NwLmNlcnRpZmlrYXQuZGsvb2NzcC9zdGF0dXMwGwYD VR0RBBQwEoEQbWlra2VsQGhvZWdoLm9yZzCBhAYDVR0fBH0wezBLoEmgR6RFMEMxCzAJBgNVBAYT AkRLMQwwCgYDVQQKEwNUREMxFDASBgNVBAMTC1REQyBPQ0VTIENBMRAwDgYDVQQDEwdDUkwyODU4 MCygKqAohiZodHRwOi8vY3JsLm9jZXMuY2VydGlmaWthdC5kay9vY2VzLmNybDAfBgNVHSMEGDAW gBRgtYXsVmR+EhknZx1QFUtzrjv5EjAdBgNVHQ4EFgQU2yH452SE9z/FWNB9LEdD4NpJerYwCQYD VR0TBAIwADAZBgkqhkiG9n0HQQAEDDAKGwRWNy4xAwIDqDANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQUFAAOCAQEAfPFl /JwTWzAB9WGsUzg7h5y2FGcNTvr7Zy4f/E7z+ux4Ysk5FdZv7rEsbCRPPyCWV2+YqhhKbseNI7wC cFW0fOHDIGb50vkE4GALn4D3WDTTwl7fIVY7Vvt2to2TVI/K/Z3gjdKDuVYl54d2GvxLMDZ2VnKB rT/QqMJsS5pSHmQt2W7M4OAlKFFJ/Z0//qc6RM2U3IBBhDVR22mrS7tcqt+jH9ID96UqAadaVzsc nljlBdeHkh1lml9d6urUgfIvLKmoJcX9W9U2C6etgvp2ZR569/v9xG7M2UJktIVN2D0x9kBZoXsW NX/ASsL4/YxaLKEHRGBBcwOr87s3Vj55lzGCAdUwggHRAgEBMDkwMTELMAkGA1UEBhMCREsxDDAK BgNVBAoTA1REQzEUMBIGA1UEAxMLVERDIE9DRVMgQ0ECBEVzyswwCQYFKw4DAhoFAKCB8zAYBgkq hkiG9w0BCQMxCwYJKoZIhvcNAQcBMBwGCSqGSIb3DQEJBTEPFw0wODEwMTcwNzU3NDhaMCMGCSqG SIb3DQEJBDEWBBTKocd5MZtDxw5BVa28hsvnFnc4DTBIBgkrBgEEAYI3EAQxOzA5MDExCzAJBgNV BAYTAkRLMQwwCgYDVQQKEwNUREMxFDASBgNVBAMTC1REQyBPQ0VTIENBAgRFc8rMMEoGCyqGSIb3 DQEJEAILMTugOTAxMQswCQYDVQQGEwJESzEMMAoGA1UEChMDVERDMRQwEgYDVQQDEwtUREMgT0NF UyBDQQIERXPKzDANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQEFAASBgJGyXYxdiZMbi2eYY+vl0kkNzKvd2t301+P11xeS rqPX9K1BXHzP4Yjl7lZoRnNNuWpRuLCtAbxNfA31JTCDu7LcSQZBxGvLldDAoku5YcuIiAFa6A0P GQuhFV0WxgMuiVreQLQONam0yOOF6PepePuXCjEqPIt2SR/lrnU8M6XHAAAAAAAA --Apple-Mail-1--1037551574--