X-Original-To: pgsql-sql-postgresql.org@postgresql.org Received: from localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.208.251]) by postgresql.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75DA19FA666 for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2006 12:21:09 -0300 (ADT) Received: from postgresql.org ([200.46.204.71]) by localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.208.251]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 82052-07 for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2006 12:21:04 -0300 (ADT) X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey- Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.184]) by postgresql.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 497899FA506 for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2006 12:21:05 -0300 (ADT) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id p77so744223nfc for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2006 08:21:03 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references:x-google-sender-auth; b=qDM72Y5Ol3ptQvnGtVlNtaHtAjSf1S7JH2u8fMX0xWIp27oYFtAM/O3hPYMrXYLeiORoLVRRmfyqyRRcvdoIduEtLD8F3vZlBE2+4QMHwpObNeRaI27ZXQA2Xc3ryxdRIsGyMdp3oye4o2+OuP8YQ+o7XS8aCcX/XETEYrtk71k= Received: by 10.78.177.11 with SMTP id z11mr3163632hue; Wed, 26 Jul 2006 08:21:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.78.32.10 with HTTP; Wed, 26 Jul 2006 08:21:01 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:21:01 -0500 From: "Aaron Bono" To: "Chris Browne" Subject: Re: SQL generator Cc: pgsql-sql@postgresql.org In-Reply-To: <60k661a07f.fsf@dba2.int.libertyrms.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_166911_3262485.1153927261627" References: <1153395978.590189.261100@75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> <60k661a07f.fsf@dba2.int.libertyrms.com> X-Google-Sender-Auth: 83bfe2c7efe962d7 X-Virus-Scanned: Maia Mailguard 1.0.1 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.465 tagged_above=0 required=5 tests=AWL, DNS_FROM_RFC_ABUSE, HTML_MESSAGE, SPF_PASS X-Spam-Level: X-Archive-Number: 200607/318 X-Sequence-Number: 25892 ------=_Part_166911_3262485.1153927261627 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline On 7/25/06, Chris Browne wrote: > > "Bit Byter" writes: > > I would like to know what the underlying SQL statement will look > > like, so that I can use this knowlege to build a generic parser that > > creates SQL statements from the "English like" text, using the > > syntax I described above. > > I seem to recall that Lotus tried doing this once upon a time with > trying to build an "english-like" interface for doing "business > intelligence-like" queries against spreadsheets. > > Nobody likely remembers HAL; it was underwhelmingly useful. > > In effect, anyone that was skilful enough at composing "English-like" > queries to get HAL to work was likely to find the "native" methods > more convenient. There was a company near where I live who recently tried to do natural language parsing for search engines - like Ask Jeeves. It was an utter failure but before they got far enough to see that, they did a study of users to see how they search. They found that people adapted to learn how to "talk in the search engine's language" fairly easily and it has actually become unnatural for people to talk to search engines with a natural language. I have had so many problems with users who know a little SQL causing database crashes and slow downs. I don't think I would recommend allowing someone who can't even do SQL access to a database. If you still think it is a good idea to do this, good luck and I hope you prove us wrong. But just keep in mind you are going to be attempting something that has been tried before with little success. Maybe you will figure out what your predecessors were missing... Bottom line though, just how difficult is SQL to read and write anyway? It is a hell of a lot easier to read and write than any other computer language I have seen. ================================================================== Aaron Bono Aranya Software Technologies, Inc. http://www.aranya.com ================================================================== ------=_Part_166911_3262485.1153927261627 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline On 7/25/06, Chris Browne <cbbrowne@acm.org> wrote:
"Bit Byter" <takashi_949@hotmail.com> writes:
> I would like to know what the underlying SQL statement will look
> like, so that I can use this knowlege to build a generic parser that
> creates SQL statements from the "English like" text, using the
> syntax I described above.

I seem to recall that Lotus tried doing this once upon a time with
trying to build an "english-like" interface for doing "business
intelligence-like" queries against spreadsheets.

Nobody likely remembers HAL; it was underwhelmingly useful.

In effect, anyone that was skilful enough at composing "English-like"
queries to get HAL to work was likely to find the "native" methods
more convenient.

 
There was a company near where I live who recently tried to do natural language parsing for search engines - like Ask Jeeves.  It was an utter failure but before they got far enough to see that, they did a study of users to see how they search.  They found that people adapted to learn how to "talk in the search engine's language" fairly easily and it has actually become unnatural for people to talk to search engines with a natural language.

I have had so many problems with users who know a little SQL causing database crashes and slow downs.  I don't think I would recommend allowing someone who can't even do SQL access to a database.

If you still think it is a good idea to do this, good luck and I hope you prove us wrong.  But just keep in mind you are going to be attempting something that has been tried before with little success.  Maybe you will figure out what your predecessors were missing...

Bottom line though, just how difficult is SQL to read and write anyway?  It is a hell of a lot easier to read and write than any other computer language I have seen.

==================================================================
   Aaron Bono
   Aranya Software Technologies, Inc.
   http://www.aranya.com
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