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From: Guillaume Lelarge <guillaume@lelarge.info>
Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2024 15:08:51 +0100
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Subject: Re: Minor backend fr.po mistake
To: Alvaro Herrera <alvherre@alvh.no-ip.org>
Cc: Thomas Munro <thomas.munro@gmail.com>, pgsql-translators@postgresql.org
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Le sam. 30 nov. 2024 =C3=A0 15:00, Alvaro Herrera <alvherre@alvh.no-ip.org>=
 a
=C3=A9crit :

> On 2024-Nov-30, Thomas Munro wrote:
>
> > #, c-format
> > msgid "This may be because of a non-immutable index expression."
> > msgstr "Ceci peut =C3=AAtre d=C3=BB =C3=A0 une expression d'index immut=
able."
> >
> > Should be "NON immutable".
>
> Agreed.
>
> > (Or non immuable, or is that just muable...  Just kidding but I am a
> > bit confused about why "immutable" is preserved in English.  In this
> > case it's referring to observed behaviour of an expression that must
> > have been considered immutable by static analysis but seems not to be
> > at execution time.  In another case we use the French word "immuable"
> > (no T) when talking about immutability by static analysis (that is,
> > whether all functions are declared IMMUTABLE).  Other messages and
> > languages made various choices about when to translate, quote or
> > uppercase the words immutable and volatile.  Wow, this is hard.)
>
> Yeah, it is hard.  Sometimes we keep the English term because for the
> user it's clearer exactly which property is meant.  For instance, in the
> Spanish translation I used to translate "locks" as "candados" and
> "triggers" as "disparadores", but per user feedback I ended reverting
> that into using the English words in quotes.  Examples:
>
> msgid "permission denied for event trigger %s"
> msgstr "permiso denegado al =E2=80=9Ctrigger=E2=80=9D por eventos %s"
>
> msgid "could not obtain lock on relation \"%s.%s\""
> msgstr "no se pudo bloquear un =E2=80=9Clock=E2=80=9D en la relaci=C3=B3n=
 =C2=AB%s.%s=C2=BB"
>
> (This is quite new and has not yet propagated to 17, but it will by the
> February release).  I think users understand this better.
>
>
While I still translate lock in french ("verrou"), I don't translate
trigger anymore. Noone understood what I meant with "d=C3=A9clencheur". And
every DBA, even French ones :) , knows what a trigger is.


> Anyway I see that the French translation tends to use "immutable"
> everywhere rather than "immuable".  It might be just a typo, or somebody
> was not consistent.
>
>
I tend to stick with "immutable", as French people understand this term.
Maybe there's still some "immuable", I'll try to fix them.


--=20
Guillaume.

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail=
_attr">Le=C2=A0sam. 30 nov. 2024 =C3=A0=C2=A015:00, Alvaro Herrera &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:alvherre@alvh.no-ip.org">alvherre@alvh.no-ip.org</a>&gt; a =
=C3=A9crit=C2=A0:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margi=
n:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex=
">On 2024-Nov-30, Thomas Munro wrote:<br>
<br>
&gt; #, c-format<br>
&gt; msgid &quot;This may be because of a non-immutable index expression.&q=
uot;<br>
&gt; msgstr &quot;Ceci peut =C3=AAtre d=C3=BB =C3=A0 une expression d&#39;i=
ndex immutable.&quot;<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Should be &quot;NON immutable&quot;.<br>
<br>
Agreed.<br>
<br>
&gt; (Or non immuable, or is that just muable...=C2=A0 Just kidding but I a=
m a<br>
&gt; bit confused about why &quot;immutable&quot; is preserved in English.=
=C2=A0 In this<br>
&gt; case it&#39;s referring to observed behaviour of an expression that mu=
st<br>
&gt; have been considered immutable by static analysis but seems not to be<=
br>
&gt; at execution time.=C2=A0 In another case we use the French word &quot;=
immuable&quot;<br>
&gt; (no T) when talking about immutability by static analysis (that is,<br=
>
&gt; whether all functions are declared IMMUTABLE).=C2=A0 Other messages an=
d<br>
&gt; languages made various choices about when to translate, quote or<br>
&gt; uppercase the words immutable and volatile.=C2=A0 Wow, this is hard.)<=
br>
<br>
Yeah, it is hard.=C2=A0 Sometimes we keep the English term because for the<=
br>
user it&#39;s clearer exactly which property is meant.=C2=A0 For instance, =
in the<br>
Spanish translation I used to translate &quot;locks&quot; as &quot;candados=
&quot; and<br>
&quot;triggers&quot; as &quot;disparadores&quot;, but per user feedback I e=
nded reverting<br>
that into using the English words in quotes.=C2=A0 Examples:<br>
<br>
msgid &quot;permission denied for event trigger %s&quot;<br>
msgstr &quot;permiso denegado al =E2=80=9Ctrigger=E2=80=9D por eventos %s&q=
uot;<br>
<br>
msgid &quot;could not obtain lock on relation \&quot;%s.%s\&quot;&quot;<br>
msgstr &quot;no se pudo bloquear un =E2=80=9Clock=E2=80=9D en la relaci=C3=
=B3n =C2=AB%s.%s=C2=BB&quot;<br>
<br>
(This is quite new and has not yet propagated to 17, but it will by the<br>
February release).=C2=A0 I think users understand this better.<br>
<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>While I still translate lock in french=
 (&quot;verrou&quot;), I don&#39;t translate trigger anymore. Noone underst=
ood what I meant with &quot;d=C3=A9clencheur&quot;. And every DBA, even Fre=
nch ones :) , knows what a trigger is.</div><div><br></div><blockquote clas=
s=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid r=
gb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<br>
Anyway I see that the French translation tends to use &quot;immutable&quot;=
<br>
everywhere rather than &quot;immuable&quot;.=C2=A0 It might be just a typo,=
 or somebody<br>
was not consistent.<br>
<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I tend to stick with &quot;immutable&q=
uot;, as French people understand this term. Maybe there&#39;s still some &=
quot;immuable&quot;, I&#39;ll try to fix them.</div></div><div><br clear=3D=
"all"></div><br><span class=3D"gmail_signature_prefix">-- </span><br><div d=
ir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"=
><div>Guillaume.<br></div></div></div></div></div></div>

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