Received: from malur.postgresql.org ([217.196.149.56]) by arkaria.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1f6eVN-0000N1-Mj for pgsql-women@arkaria.postgresql.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 15:51:21 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=malur.postgresql.org) by malur.postgresql.org with esmtp (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1f6eVM-0006ae-R8 for pgsql-women@arkaria.postgresql.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 15:51:20 +0000 Received: from magus.postgresql.org ([2a02:c0:301:0:ffff::29]) by malur.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1f6eVM-0006aV-GW for pgsql-women@lists.postgresql.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 15:51:20 +0000 Received: from mail-wm0-x22e.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c09::22e]) by magus.postgresql.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1f6eVE-0003zT-PM for pgsql-women@lists.postgresql.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 15:51:19 +0000 Received: by mail-wm0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id b127so12726058wmf.5 for ; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 08:51:12 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=dataegret-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=vSCjRJMgZhN/2jOfj/curMSzNpPTJpHyHEuHMCL5mCQ=; b=Wi65oLnKGAt+vLIm8h8vHp+8QCeg7YTs6YqqY3r/a3r/OCvnr43tHGvFX0MscGzwJK zurYRPxH57mQA5V8XPnJoLH85H2XFeS4SIbubyEvo2MV/GfCaot1pAbFGRWZTfXnf7si t0W7gPaIGqqyqLR1L6uBwkQKJe5fCMxfRQD84TbOmFWVH6NGJLbjkioW66cUZwd+9JRl ODwc9jgrz57zz9Ozw/8C7eSoF40qh7gr67tNxc5jvSOMSkO9w7mh2WB+CTkFV6xilpPO xyb5ihOZIZe7HmJVaq3H9kIomJgtip82aa5raK/G9WT20UmTfR2jzJEU8UB2AKQN4X7U obqw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=vSCjRJMgZhN/2jOfj/curMSzNpPTJpHyHEuHMCL5mCQ=; b=d77Gs7MNMAjhloEBUbzIdWwzSrUrPWkhcDCu3/MWL2rtxLJLB5s6wAhYo51yX/Quq/ F7e6Ss6lUjcY0iV7esWybAUsXhAoYAtyU2547QYvn0KBSHiRiowlIuwt8fSe/hQdC48s T34uOWuvUr0yoP2ekFyl5Y09uPyjr+dthUm6KP2paOsn5i7QGPLfex9olcg0FvMsj5i7 pgAo5Jq266rQWRH/qVj0Uj0DbP/OQIR95iqjagPo+5ENEtrgNnVXSmESPZDntKQssl8b gkaKq/UOKmgbB8p/Ty19hSPmAfXg3IIU4E/xmwkrIWzyWlio0FT4jQptU377utvd7OWh 3D9g== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tAW0fXFW1WPx2Mgr/ne0scISxduzFsDrz7hzlcQ/WOZfW37Pftn XSsuetxv2rrephRoS5dRw1keFJuaiDa34UsxzvADYCbQ X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx49R6/6XeavtYOmtkVsEwUpo6jN11y6YvKAErcgtdJ4Ug+VhlsOy1we4d6ZVe1SdEY9q3MWWUno0VRXSs8EPS28= X-Received: by 10.28.213.12 with SMTP id m12mr1120355wmg.98.1523548269888; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 08:51:09 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.135.202 with HTTP; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 08:51:09 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <38ee76b5-8bf5-9171-70de-f926b1e618c9@gmail.com> From: Valeria Kaplan Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 16:51:09 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: What we need to do To: =?UTF-8?Q?L=C3=A6titia_Avrot?= Cc: Boriss Mejias , pgsql-women@lists.postgresql.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1145a8b86cde900569a8b9fe" List-Id: List-Help: List-Subscribe: List-Post: List-Owner: List-Archive: Precedence: bulk --001a1145a8b86cde900569a8b9fe Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Agree with L=C3=A6titia, It doesn't matter what sex you are or feel that you belong to, everyone should feel welcomed in our group and activities. In my opinion, excluding men in any way would be contra-productive. As if to say, "you are not a woman - you can't contribute" or "you will be too pushy". Those are the exact assumptions we are striving to break, no? another ++ to: Anyone (men or women) that want to force their vision to our group should be explained that it's not the way we work. On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 12:48 PM, L=C3=A6titia Avrot wrote: > Hi Boriss > > >> I think excluding men from certain activities can be positive in the goa= l >> of making women feel welcomed. For instance: Women-only IRC/Slack channe= ls >> can be a good thing. Women-only Hackathon can also help in making women >> feel welcomed. >> >> > I strongly disagree. I want everyone to feel welcome, whatever their > gender is. If you start creating little worlds without men, first you > exclude people and that's a negative message to give and then it's totall= y > artificial as our world is populated with both men and women. So if we fe= el > there is a problem with with women representation in our community, we ne= ed > to find a solution together. Men and women both have brain, so they can > both come with creative ideas. > > Cheers, > > L=C3=A6titia > --001a1145a8b86cde900569a8b9fe Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Agree with=C2=A0L=C3=A6titia,
It doesn't matter what sex y= ou are or feel that you belong to, everyone should feel welcomed in our gro= up and activities. In my opinion, excluding men in any way would be contra-= productive. As if to say, "you are not a woman - you can't contrib= ute" or "you will be too pushy". Those are the exact assumpt= ions=C2=A0we are striving to break, no?
=C2=A0
another ++ to: Anyone (men or women) that want = to force their vision to our group should be explained that it's not th= e way we work.
<= div dir=3D"ltr">


On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 12:48 PM, L=C3=A6tit= ia Avrot <laetitia.avrot@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Boriss


I think excluding men from certain activities can be positive in the goal o= f making women feel welcomed. For instance: Women-only IRC/Slack channels c= an be a good thing. Women-only Hackathon can also help in making women feel= welcomed.


I strongly disagree. I = want everyone to feel welcome, whatever their gender is. If you start creat= ing little worlds without men, first you exclude people and that's a ne= gative message to give and then it's totally artificial as our world is= populated with both men and women. So if we feel there is a problem with w= ith women representation in our community, we need to find a solution toget= her. Men and women both have brain, so they can both come with creative ide= as.

Cheers,

L=C3=A6titia

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