Subject: Re: Update on 'portal' changes

From: "Dave Page" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:18:37 -0000

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alexey Borzov [mailto:[email-masked]] 
> Sent: 08 March 2004 17:11
> To: Dave Page
> Cc: [email-masked]
> Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] Update on 'portal' changes
> 
> 
> OK, let's paraphrase: what is the reason for having one 
> project for all websites instead of one project per website? 
> I got the impression that *different* developers work on 
> different websites...

Only recently. In the past that was not so much the case.

> > We *have* created a separate CVS module which should be more than 
> > enough segregation.
> 
> Can CVS write access be given for this module only?

No, unfortunately not.

Regards, Dave.

---

From: Alexey Borzov <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 20:33:55 +0300

Hi!

>>Can CVS write access be given for this module only?

::sigh::
Then this does not sound like "enough segregation".

What exactly are the reasons against the new project?

---

From: Robert Treat <[email-masked]>
Date: 08 Mar 2004 17:09:41 -0500

> What exactly are the reasons against the new project?

In the past website development has been segregated and because of that
interaction between the various groups has suffered. (Kind of like how
everyone complains that all of the sites look different and things like
that) The hope is that by uniting them under one project we can get some
coordination working between the folks involved at each site, and even
better would be to have everyone involved to actually contribute to each
site. (A good example right now is I have 4 or 5 minor changes I need to
make on techdocs that I just haven't had time to do) 

As a side note, I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to giving you (Alexy)
cvs commit privileges except that you have a tendency to fly off the
handle that makes me a little bit nervous... 

Robert Treat
-- 
Build A Brighter Lamp :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL

---

From: David Costa <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:20:15 +0100

> handle that makes me a little bit nervous...

Hello Robert,
I think that Alexey deserve some trust. He has already write access to 
a great deal of PEAR source modules
(http://pear.php.net/user/avb) or the whole PEAR three and I would 
never imagine a reason to mess up anything.

I would say +1. He might not be very diplomatic, but if he can save 
you/the web team some valuable time, why not ?

BTW
Is the gborg  feed  going live sometime soon  ? (no, I am not asking 
for CVS access :) )

All the best

Regards,
David Costa, PHP-PostgreSQL Advocacy team     http://postgresql.org
david at postgresql ddoot org                 gurugeek att php dot net
$dsn = 'pgsql://world:most_advanced@localhost/open_source_database';

---

From: Robert Treat <[email-masked]>
Date: 08 Mar 2004 18:22:07 -0500

> you/the web team some valuable time, why not ?

I guess we're still trying to decide if he can save us valuable time :-)
I'd certainly grant his coding efforts argue in his favor. 

> Is the gborg  feed  going live sometime soon  ? (no, I am not asking 

Not sure if Dave has had a chance to look at it yet... my current plate
is finishing weekly news today/tonight... then I need to do techdocs
updates, then I might be able to grab the patch Chris posted and put it
up... not sure how far I will get tonight so we'll see.

Robert Treat

---

From: Chris Ryan <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 05:45:12 -0800 (PST)

--- David Costa <[email-masked]> wrote:
 -- snip --
> Is the gborg  feed  going live sometime soon  ? (no, I am not asking 
 -- snip --

    It kept slipping my mind to setup the cron on gborg to make the rss
feed live. I have done so now and it updates once and hour on the half
hour.

Chris Ryan

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com

---

From: Alexey Borzov <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 17:32:54 +0300

Hi!

> I guess we're still trying to decide if he can save us valuable time :-)

Ahem. I'd learn that my work is not needed *now* rather than later, when 
  I've spent more time on it...

---

From: Robert Treat <[email-masked]>
Date: 09 Mar 2004 10:04:33 -0500

>   I've spent more time on it...

No, the work is needed now, and quite frankly I have more faith that
you'll get it done than I do that we will, at least anytime soon. It's
just that we keep going round and round on the whole "working together"
thing... a similar issue came up on interfaces, with libtcl. A new guy
had a bunch of patches he wanted to submit but the project maintainers
had been idle for awhile, so he wanted to take over the project. The
admins stated they wanted to stay on, so he forked the project... all
bad imho. ISTM that when your new to a project, you should assume that
you don't know as much as folks that are currently running things. If
you want to take over things, the way to do it is by putting in enough
effort to show your serious, killing people with kindness, and by
submitting enough patches that the developers decide it's too much
hassle to stand in your way. At least that's how I have tried to
approach things...

Robert Treat

---

From: Alexey Borzov <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 22:22:32 +0300

Hi!

Robert Treat wrote:
> thing...

Seems like you are bent on teaching me about how Open Source works once again...

I already learned that this "working together" thing requires *mutual* desire 
to, uhm, work together. If such a desire is not found on one side, then this 
side can come up with really inventive excuses.

Consider: Marc had some disagreements with me, too. But I already have a 
development server set up at postgresql.org domain.

On the other hand *you* write "I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to giving you 
(Alexy) cvs commit privileges except that you have a tendency to fly off the
handle that makes me a little bit nervous..."

Are you *this* afraid of me defacing postgresql.org?.. ;]

> a similar issue came up on interfaces, with libtcl. A new guy
> you don't know as much as folks that are currently running things.

Oh, yeah. Reading the current traffic I got the impression that the folks who 
are running things know as little as myself. What's up with techdocs? What is 
this PGFoundry thing? Why is search broken? ;]

---

From: Robert Treat <[email-masked]>
Date: 09 Mar 2004 16:53:10 -0500

> Seems like you are bent on teaching me about how Open Source works once again...

I am almost as stubborn a teacher as those students who refuse to learn
:-)

> handle that makes me a little bit nervous..."

On the same hand... do you think Marc makes his decisions in a vacuum?

> Are you *this* afraid of me defacing postgresql.org?.. ;]

not really... after all that's the point of CVS isn't it?  

> this PGFoundry thing? Why is search broken? ;]

And some people want us to be even *more* segregated...

Robert Treat

---

From: Alexey Borzov <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:16:47 +0300

Hi!

> And some people want us to be even *more* segregated...

You can't be even *more* segregated. There already are two distinct groups: the 
so-called "website team" that doesn't have a slightest clue what's up with the 
websites and the people who actually do the work.

I feel that I'd rather align myself with the latter.

---

From: "Gavin M. Roy" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:07:15 -0800

>
> You can't be even *more* segregated. There already are two distinct 
> groups: the so-called "website team" that doesn't have a slightest 
> clue what's up with the websites and the people who actually do the work.
>

How about working with the former so that we can help contribute and 
bring all these things forward that much faster?

Gavin