Message-ID: <450D5E85.6080807@commandprompt.com>
Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2006 07:41:09 -0700
From: "Joshua D. Drake" <jd@commandprompt.com>
Organization: Command Prompt, Inc.
User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (X11/20060728)
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To: Magnus Hagander <mha@sollentuna.net>
CC: Gregory Stark <stark@enterprisedb.com>, Josh Berkus <josh@agliodbs.com>,
	pgsql-www@postgresql.org, Martijn van Oosterhout <kleptog@svana.org>,
	Neil Conway <neilc@samurai.com>, Dave Page <dpage@vale-housing.co.uk>,
	pgsql-hackers@postgresql.org
Subject: Re: [HACKERS] Developer's Wiki
References: <6BCB9D8A16AC4241919521715F4D8BCEA0FBB6@algol.sollentuna.se>
In-Reply-To: <6BCB9D8A16AC4241919521715F4D8BCEA0FBB6@algol.sollentuna.se>
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> 
>> 1. It isn't easy to login
> 
> Really? You're kidding, right? You click a link that requires login, and
> you get a browser login box. How much easier can it be?

What URL are you talking about?

http://www.postgresql.org/docs/techdocs

Where do I click login? Where do I click create account? Where do I 
click to login?
> 
>> 2. It is even harder to create a login
> 
> Again, really? If yo uget the login prompt and hit cancel (or just login
> with an invalid password), that says "you need a community login. If you
> don't hav eone, click here to read about it." If you "click here", you
> get to the page where you sign up.

You are corrent, now that I have tried it.

If I click edit, and then cancel because I don't have a login I get a 
page that tells me:

* Login required

* Accessing this resource requires a community login. If you don't have 
* one, you can read about it here. To try again, just press your
* browsers Refresh button.

Which pretty much goes against how every other site in the world does 
it. I shouldn't have to throw an exception to perform the correct behavior.

That page that tells me where to login should come *BEFORE* I get a 
login prompt.

> 
> Now, explaining this process on the frontpage of the techdocs part of
> the site might not be a bad idea at all (in fact, it's a good idea :-P),
> but do you honestly think the process is complex? If so, what should we
> do to make it easier?

Let me rephrase. It is not complex, it is not standard. Which makes it 
confusing.

What I expect is this:

Open web browser
Go to techdocs

Either the first thing I see is,

  * You are not logged in, if you wish to edit content click here to 
login or create an account.

  * When I click edit the above happens.

>> 3. There is no creation of login for most people because they 
>> don't know they have to go to the community portion of the 
>> www site to get to it.
> 
> See above, you don't need to do this.
> 

You are correct but most people are going to be confused. They are going 
to click edit, see a login/password they don't have and move on. Heck I 
probably have hit cancel before and didn't even read the text after.

Why?

Because the text after a login failure or cancel when using httpd auth 
is almost ALWAYS telling me I need a correct login. Not giving a link to 
login.

Sincerely,

Joshua D. Drake

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