Received: from localhost (unknown [200.46.204.183]) by postgresql.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEA7E9F9475 for ; Sun, 4 Nov 2007 14:14:00 -0400 (AST) Received: from postgresql.org ([200.46.204.71]) by localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.204.183]) (amavisd-maia, port 10024) with ESMTP id 14304-06 for ; Sun, 4 Nov 2007 14:13:55 -0400 (AST) X-Greylist: from auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.5 Received: from smtp148.iad.emailsrvr.com (smtp148.iad.emailsrvr.com [207.97.245.148]) by postgresql.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 993379F9476 for ; Sun, 4 Nov 2007 14:13:55 -0400 (AST) Received: from relay4.r5.iad.mlsrvr.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by relay4.r5.iad.mlsrvr.com (SMTP Server) with ESMTP id F1F38C2A6; Sun, 4 Nov 2007 13:13:54 -0500 (EST) Received: by relay4.r5.iad.mlsrvr.com (Authenticated sender: chander-AT-otg-nc.com) with ESMTP id 888ECC1DF; Sun, 4 Nov 2007 13:13:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <472E0BE1.6040607@otg-nc.com> Date: Sun, 04 Nov 2007 13:13:53 -0500 From: Chander Ganesan User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (Windows/20070728) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Joshua D. Drake" CC: Dave Page , "Marc G. Fournier" , Kevin Hunter , Postgres WWW List , Peter Eisentraut Subject: Re: Training events policy ... first test case References: <200711031703310000@114527600> <20071103142105.2d29bc1b@scratch> <472D02A3.1070404@postgresql.org> <20071103205146.63a6997c@scratch> <472D505C.8010009@earlham.edu> <30F7311191EA4127FE35229B@ganymede.hub.org> <472D5E5F.8070703@otg-nc.com> <9599AD77F626EA5EFDBE4859@ganymede.hub.org> <472DD12F.5060805@otg-nc.com> <472DE3C2.9030703@postgresql.org> <472DEB0B.2060207@otg-nc.com> <20071104082524.4ae7524c@scratch> <472DF8D8.1000902@otg-nc.com> <20071104093921.1764ce36@scratch> <472E06FC.5080302@otg-nc.com> <20071104100021.2d67ad72@scratch> In-Reply-To: <20071104100021.2d67ad72@scratch> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------040404030702090109090105" X-Virus-Scanned: Maia Mailguard 1.0.1 X-Archive-Number: 200711/110 X-Sequence-Number: 12888 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------040404030702090109090105 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Joshua D. Drake wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > On Sun, 04 Nov 2007 12:53:00 -0500 > Chander Ganesan wrote: > > >>> Perhaps as 50.00 donation should be required for each training >>> listing. >>> > > >> Me, puts of community supporter hat....we donate either way ;-) >> However, I think that $50 isn't much of a deterrent. I think if you >> > > 50 * 1 isn't much of a deterrent. > 50 * 12 could be. > I disagree. Consider that if they sell a class for $2200 apiece, 600 is a pittance...it's less than the profit of 1 student, and if you consider that listing a class 12 times brings them, say 2 students (probably more, but I'm being ultra-conservative here), it's still worth the cost. Consider that we post a limited number of classes and make regular donations that are much larger than $600 (note: we offer air, hotel, and training for that price...so our margins are considerably smaller). > Especially since it would be non refundable and the listing time is > short, but it isn't so much the dollar amount (I left it low on > purpose). It is the fact they must donate. > > Most unsavory companies I know are also cheap bastards and won't spend > a nickel if they don't have to. I strongly doubt that we are generating > enough leads for certfirst for them to go through the requisition > process for the donations. > I think you'd be surprised...companies do something similar with Novell, and have to pay Novell something like $1000/year/location listed (they can then list an unlimited number of classes at the location) but still find it worthwhile, IMHO Novell's training locater is virtually useless, the number of courses listed is an order of magnitude greater than the number that actually run... A single lead that turned into an on-site course would more than pay for a good 100+ listings... Besides, if a company is running that many courses, then they can definitely afford to pony up a bit more change...especially here in the US. I would propose some kind of sliding scale based on the country perhaps...we don't want to price Dextra out of a market....or any other company that does business in a weaker currency (though the way things are going there might not be that many...). > Sincerely, > > Joshua D. Drake > > > > > > - -- > > === The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. === > Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240 > PostgreSQL solutions since 1997 http://www.commandprompt.com/ > UNIQUE NOT NULL > Donate to the PostgreSQL Project: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate > PostgreSQL Replication: http://www.commandprompt.com/products/ > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) > > iD8DBQFHLgi6ATb/zqfZUUQRAr5NAJ90DsTVKDf6FAAQ5Os3H8FXqeaJMACeL6WQ > dpd0WyEc93CC6nYSwd/nCaE= > =CZ/m > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > -- Chander Ganesan Open Technology Group, Inc. One Copley Parkway, Suite 210 Morrisville, NC 27560 Phone: 877-258-8987/919-463-0999 http://www.otg-nc.com --------------040404030702090109090105 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Joshua D. Drake wrote: 
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On Sun, 04 Nov 2007 12:53:00 -0500
Chander Ganesan <chander@otg-nc.com> wrote:

  
Perhaps as 50.00 donation should be required for each training
listing. 
      

  
Me, puts of community supporter hat....we donate either way ;-)  
However, I think that $50 isn't much of a deterrent.  I think if you 
    

50 * 1 isn't much of a deterrent.
50 * 12 could be.
I disagree.  Consider that if they sell a class for $2200 apiece, 600 is a pittance...it's less than the profit of 1 student, and if you consider that listing a class 12 times brings them, say 2 students (probably more, but I'm being ultra-conservative here), it's still worth the cost.

Consider that we post a limited number of classes and make regular donations that are much larger than $600 (note: we offer air, hotel, and training for that price...so our margins are considerably smaller).
Especially since it would be non refundable and the listing time is
short, but it isn't so much the dollar amount (I left it low on
purpose). It is the fact they must donate.

Most unsavory companies I know are also cheap bastards and won't spend
a nickel if they don't have to. I strongly doubt that we are generating
enough leads for certfirst for them to go through the requisition
process for the donations.
I think you'd be surprised...companies do something similar with Novell, and have to pay Novell something like $1000/year/location listed (they can then list an unlimited number of classes at the location) but still find it worthwhile, IMHO Novell's training locater is virtually useless, the number of courses listed is an order of magnitude greater than the number that actually run...  A single lead that turned into an on-site course would more than pay for a good 100+ listings...

Besides, if a company is running that many courses, then they can definitely afford to pony up a bit more change...especially here in the US.  I would propose some kind of sliding scale based on the country perhaps...we don't want to price Dextra out of a market....or any other company that does business in a weaker currency (though the way things are going there might not be that many...).
Sincerely,

Joshua D. Drake





- -- 

      === The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. ===
Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564   24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240
PostgreSQL solutions since 1997  http://www.commandprompt.com/
			UNIQUE NOT NULL
Donate to the PostgreSQL Project: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate
PostgreSQL Replication: http://www.commandprompt.com/products/

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-- 
Chander Ganesan
Open Technology Group, Inc.
One Copley Parkway, Suite 210
Morrisville, NC  27560
Phone: 877-258-8987/919-463-0999
http://www.otg-nc.com
--------------040404030702090109090105--