Message-ID: <5123C9D9.4010407@2ndQuadrant.com>
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2013 13:52:09 -0500
From: Greg Smith <greg@2ndQuadrant.com>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.7;
	rv:14.0) Gecko/20120713 Thunderbird/14.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Magnus Hagander <magnus@hagander.net>
CC: Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>,
	Alvaro Herrera <alvherre@2ndquadrant.com>,
	Christoph Berg <myon@debian.org>,
	Stefan Kaltenbrunner <stefan@kaltenbrunner.cc>,
	Josh Berkus <josh@agliodbs.com>, Martin Pitt <mpitt@debian.org>,
	PostgreSQL WWW <pgsql-www@postgresql.org>,
	PostgreSQL in Debian <pgsql-pkg-debian@postgresql.org>,
	Tom Lane <tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us>
Subject: Re: [pgsql-pkg-debian] Re: We should not transition to
	apt.postgresql.org until we have a PPA
References: <20130214122643.GF30046@msgid.df7cb.de>
	<511D2E58.6010705@agliodbs.com> <511D4E61.5050808@kaltenbrunner.cc>
	<20130216013854.GD12029@momjian.us>
	<20130216084421.GA1223@msgid.df7cb.de>
	<20130216153309.GF12029@momjian.us>
	<20130216234034.GG12029@momjian.us>
	<20130217054028.GA6000@alvh.no-ip.org>
	<20130217121745.GH12029@momjian.us>
	<20130218020824.GA4691@alvh.no-ip.org>
	<20130219120304.GB20153@momjian.us>
	<5123952C.1030408@2ndQuadrant.com>
	<CABUevExD808PKJEMuhLnH_pk8hD9yJ3eSA2Dv0q_EP1-o7B5Mg@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: 
 <CABUevExD808PKJEMuhLnH_pk8hD9yJ3eSA2Dv0q_EP1-o7B5Mg@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Precedence: bulk
Sender: pgsql-www-owner@postgresql.org

On 2/19/13 10:22 AM, Magnus Hagander wrote:
>> Typical complaint:
>> http://costela.net/2009/12/notes-on-the-google-chrome-debian-package/
>
> Yes, they do a number of things you're not "supposed to do" on debian.
> Our packages are actually *very* well behaved on debian and ubuntu,
> and that is a property we should work hard to keep. That doesn't mean
> we can't improve the installation experience, of course.

That was the main thing I thought was being talked past.  Some people 
look at the ease of use of a PPA or the Debian Chrome installer and 
think "why isn't PostgreSQL this easy?"  It could be, and if Martin is 
willing to pull some more infrastructure into postgresql-common that 
would make things a lot smoother.

The reasons why a really simple UI wasn't the first target for something 
worth shipping are hard to understand.  You need to have spent a good 
bit of time packaging for Debian to appreciate why the Chrome install 
smells funny to some.  I just barely get it myself.  You can't really 
nail a PPA style release and something that makes all the Debian admins 
happy at the same time.  There's a deep and not obvious disconnect 
between the goals of each type of packaging.  I read "We should not 
transition to apt.postgresql.org until we have a PPA" as being like "we 
shouldn't release the apple juice until we have the perfect oranges". 
All important things, but they're not the same target.

-- 
Greg Smith   2ndQuadrant US    greg@2ndQuadrant.com   Baltimore, MD
PostgreSQL Training, Services, and 24x7 Support www.2ndQuadrant.com


-- 
Sent via pgsql-www mailing list (pgsql-www@postgresql.org)
To make changes to your subscription:
http://www.postgresql.org/mailpref/pgsql-www