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* Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-06-30 14:47 Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Daniel Westermann (DWE) @ 2021-06-30 14:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
Hi,
"Add predefined roles pg_read_all_data and pg_write_all_data (Stephen Frost)
These non-login roles can be used to give read or write permission to all tables, views, and sequences."
pg_read_all_data links to "Predefined roles", pg_write_all_data does not. Is that on purpose? At least it looks strange.
Regards
Daniel
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-01 19:48 Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>
parent: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Euler Taveira @ 2021-07-01 19:48 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
On Wed, Jun 30, 2021, at 11:47 AM, Daniel Westermann (DWE) wrote:
> "Add predefined roles pg_read_all_data and pg_write_all_data (Stephen Frost)
>
> These non-login roles can be used to give read or write permission to all tables, views, and sequences."
>
> pg_read_all_data links to "Predefined roles", pg_write_all_data does not. Is that on purpose? At least it looks strange.
It seems so. Once you click on the link, you will notice that pg_write_all_data
is there too. Role names are similar to make the reader suspect that both
descriptions will be on the same page.
--
Euler Taveira
EDB https://www.enterprisedb.com/
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-01 21:46 Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
parent: Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Stephen Frost @ 2021-07-01 21:46 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>; +Cc: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>; Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
Greetings,
* Euler Taveira (euler@eulerto.com) wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 30, 2021, at 11:47 AM, Daniel Westermann (DWE) wrote:
> > "Add predefined roles pg_read_all_data and pg_write_all_data (Stephen Frost)
> >
> > These non-login roles can be used to give read or write permission to all tables, views, and sequences."
> >
> > pg_read_all_data links to "Predefined roles", pg_write_all_data does not. Is that on purpose? At least it looks strange.
> It seems so. Once you click on the link, you will notice that pg_write_all_data
> is there too. Role names are similar to make the reader suspect that both
> descriptions will be on the same page.
I tend to agree that it'd make sense to have them both as links.
I've CC'd Bruce to make sure he sees this discussion.
Thanks,
Stephen
Attachments:
[application/pgp-signature] signature.asc (818B, ../../20210701214616.GT20766@tamriel.snowman.net/2-signature.asc)
download
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-02 01:35 Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
parent: Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Bruce Momjian @ 2021-07-02 01:35 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>; +Cc: Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>; Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 05:46:16PM -0400, Stephen Frost wrote:
> Greetings,
>
> * Euler Taveira (euler@eulerto.com) wrote:
> > On Wed, Jun 30, 2021, at 11:47 AM, Daniel Westermann (DWE) wrote:
> > > "Add predefined roles pg_read_all_data and pg_write_all_data (Stephen Frost)
> > >
> > > These non-login roles can be used to give read or write permission to all tables, views, and sequences."
> > >
> > > pg_read_all_data links to "Predefined roles", pg_write_all_data does not. Is that on purpose? At least it looks strange.
> > It seems so. Once you click on the link, you will notice that pg_write_all_data
> > is there too. Role names are similar to make the reader suspect that both
> > descriptions will be on the same page.
>
> I tend to agree that it'd make sense to have them both as links.
>
> I've CC'd Bruce to make sure he sees this discussion.
I normally link to only the _first_ mention of something, and since they
are both in the same section, I didn't add a link for the second one.
Adding a second link might suggest that there is more information
available, even though the coarseness of our links means that section is
the same.
--
Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> https://momjian.us
EDB https://enterprisedb.com
If only the physical world exists, free will is an illusion.
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-02 01:47 Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
parent: Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Stephen Frost @ 2021-07-02 01:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>; +Cc: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>; Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
Greetings,
On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 21:35 Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 05:46:16PM -0400, Stephen Frost wrote:
> > Greetings,
> >
> > * Euler Taveira (euler@eulerto.com) wrote:
> > > On Wed, Jun 30, 2021, at 11:47 AM, Daniel Westermann (DWE) wrote:
> > > > "Add predefined roles pg_read_all_data and pg_write_all_data
> (Stephen Frost)
> > > >
> > > > These non-login roles can be used to give read or write permission
> to all tables, views, and sequences."
> > > >
> > > > pg_read_all_data links to "Predefined roles", pg_write_all_data does
> not. Is that on purpose? At least it looks strange.
> > > It seems so. Once you click on the link, you will notice that
> pg_write_all_data
> > > is there too. Role names are similar to make the reader suspect that
> both
> > > descriptions will be on the same page.
> >
> > I tend to agree that it'd make sense to have them both as links.
> >
> > I've CC'd Bruce to make sure he sees this discussion.
>
> I normally link to only the _first_ mention of something, and since they
> are both in the same section, I didn't add a link for the second one.
> Adding a second link might suggest that there is more information
> available, even though the coarseness of our links means that section is
> the same.
Perhaps the wording would be better as something like:
New <a href=“…”>predefined roles</a> for granting access to read/write all
tables have been added, called pg_read_all_data and pg_write_all_data ..?
Or something along those lines?
Just a thought.
Perhaps another idea would be to make one link which includes both names.
Thanks,
Stephen
>
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-02 01:57 Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
parent: Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Bruce Momjian @ 2021-07-02 01:57 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>; +Cc: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>; Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 09:47:47PM -0400, Stephen Frost wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 21:35 Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote:
> I normally link to only the _first_ mention of something, and since they
> are both in the same section, I didn't add a link for the second one.
> Adding a second link might suggest that there is more information
> available, even though the coarseness of our links means that section is
> the same.
>
> Perhaps the wording would be better as something like:
>
> New <a href=“…”>predefined roles</a> for granting access to read/write all
> tables have been added, called pg_read_all_data and pg_write_all_data ..?
>
> Or something along those lines?
I have avoided doing that since the link is about the roles, not about
the term "predefined roles".
> Just a thought.
>
> Perhaps another idea would be to make one link which includes both names.
Uh, that is going to look odd, I am afraid.
--
Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> https://momjian.us
EDB https://enterprisedb.com
If only the physical world exists, free will is an illusion.
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-02 02:01 Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
parent: Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Stephen Frost @ 2021-07-02 02:01 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>; +Cc: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>; Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
Greetings,
On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 21:57 Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 09:47:47PM -0400, Stephen Frost wrote:
> > On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 21:35 Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote:
> > I normally link to only the _first_ mention of something, and since
> they
> > are both in the same section, I didn't add a link for the second one.
> > Adding a second link might suggest that there is more information
> > available, even though the coarseness of our links means that
> section is
> > the same.
> >
> > Perhaps the wording would be better as something like:
> >
> > New <a href=“…”>predefined roles</a> for granting access to read/write
> all
> > tables have been added, called pg_read_all_data and pg_write_all_data ..?
> >
> > Or something along those lines?
>
> I have avoided doing that since the link is about the roles, not about
> the term "predefined roles".
I tend to agree that it’s about the roles, but it isn’t about just one of
them …
> Just a thought.
> >
> > Perhaps another idea would be to make one link which includes both names.
>
> Uh, that is going to look odd, I am afraid.
This thread started with the point that the current entry looks odd. I’m
not sure this would look more odd than what is there now.
Thanks,
Stephen
>
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-02 02:30 Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
parent: Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Bruce Momjian @ 2021-07-02 02:30 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>; +Cc: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>; Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 10:01:46PM -0400, Stephen Frost wrote:
> > Just a thought.
> >
> > Perhaps another idea would be to make one link which includes both names.
>
> Uh, that is going to look odd, I am afraid.
>
> This thread started with the point that the current entry looks odd. I’m not
> sure this would look more odd than what is there now.
If you look at the current doc version:
https://momjian.us/pgsql_docs/release-14.html
Notice that for these two items:
Remove factorial operators ! and !! (Mark Dilger)
The factorial() function is still supported. Also remove function numeric_fac().
Disallow factorial() of negative numbers (Peter Eisentraut)
Previously such cases returned 1.
Only the first mention of "factorial()" uses a link; the second item
doesn't have any link.
--
Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> https://momjian.us
EDB https://enterprisedb.com
If only the physical world exists, free will is an illusion.
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-02 05:15 Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>
parent: Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Daniel Westermann (DWE) @ 2021-07-02 05:15 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>; Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>; +Cc: Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
>On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 10:01:46PM -0400, Stephen Frost wrote:
>> > Just a thought.
>> >
>> > Perhaps another idea would be to make one link which includes both names.
>>
>> Uh, that is going to look odd, I am afraid.
>>
>> This thread started with the point that the current entry looks odd. I’m not
>> sure this would look more odd than what is there now.
>If you look at the current doc version:
>
> https://momjian.us/pgsql_docs/release-14.html
>
>Notice that for these two items:
>
> Remove factorial operators ! and !! (Mark Dilger)
> The factorial() function is still supported. Also remove function numeric_fac().
>
> Disallow factorial() of negative numbers (Peter Eisentraut)
> Previously such cases returned 1.
>
>Only the first mention of "factorial()" uses a link; the second item
>doesn't have any link.
There are other places as well, like this on:
"The postgres_fdw supports these type of scans if async_capable is set."
async_capable is not a link. Or this one:
"This speeds normalize() and IS NORMALIZED."
I still think it should be more consistent and all should be links, even if they point to the same section.
Regards
Daniel
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-02 14:47 Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>
parent: Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Euler Taveira @ 2021-07-02 14:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>; Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>; +Cc: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
On Thu, Jul 1, 2021, at 11:01 PM, Stephen Frost wrote:
>>
>> I have avoided doing that since the link is about the roles, not about
>> the term "predefined roles".
>
> I tend to agree that it’s about the roles, but it isn’t about just one of them …
I think it is clear that "predefined roles" link contains the new roles, no?
--
Euler Taveira
EDB https://www.enterprisedb.com/
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-02 17:36 Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
parent: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Bruce Momjian @ 2021-07-02 17:36 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>; +Cc: Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>; Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
On Fri, Jul 2, 2021 at 05:15:23AM +0000, Daniel Westermann (DWE) wrote:
> >On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 10:01:46PM -0400, Stephen Frost wrote:
> >Only the first mention of "factorial()" uses a link; the second item
> >doesn't have any link.
>
> There are other places as well, like this on:
> "The postgres_fdw supports these type of scans if async_capable is set."
>
> async_capable is not a link. Or this one:
> "This speeds normalize() and IS NORMALIZED."
>
> I still think it should be more consistent and all should be links, even if they point to the same section.
I am using standard typographic style, where the first mention of
something is often italics, but later mentions might not be. I am not
in favor of adding links to everthing that can have a link _unless_
there is a unique URI for each item.
--
Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> https://momjian.us
EDB https://enterprisedb.com
If only the physical world exists, free will is an illusion.
^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Link missing in the 14 release notes
@ 2021-07-05 14:30 Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
parent: Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
0 siblings, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Stephen Frost @ 2021-07-05 14:30 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>; +Cc: Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>; Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>; pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org <pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org>
Greetings,
* Bruce Momjian (bruce@momjian.us) wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 2, 2021 at 05:15:23AM +0000, Daniel Westermann (DWE) wrote:
> > >On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 10:01:46PM -0400, Stephen Frost wrote:
> > >Only the first mention of "factorial()" uses a link; the second item
> > >doesn't have any link.
> >
> > There are other places as well, like this on:
> > "The postgres_fdw supports these type of scans if async_capable is set."
> >
> > async_capable is not a link. Or this one:
> > "This speeds normalize() and IS NORMALIZED."
> >
> > I still think it should be more consistent and all should be links, even if they point to the same section.
>
> I am using standard typographic style, where the first mention of
> something is often italics, but later mentions might not be. I am not
> in favor of adding links to everthing that can have a link _unless_
> there is a unique URI for each item.
While I understand that's the approach you've been following, I don't
agree with it. Providing links gives users a way to find more
information and that applies to each equally. I don't believe users of
the website and release notes would be confused, upset, or otherwise
misunderstand when two items which are covered in the same place have a
repeated link for each of the items.
Thanks,
Stephen
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^ permalink raw reply [nested|flat] 12+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2021-07-05 14:30 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 12+ messages (download: mbox mbox.gz follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2021-06-30 14:47 Link missing in the 14 release notes Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>
2021-07-01 19:48 ` Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>
2021-07-01 21:46 ` Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
2021-07-02 01:35 ` Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
2021-07-02 01:47 ` Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
2021-07-02 01:57 ` Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
2021-07-02 02:01 ` Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
2021-07-02 02:30 ` Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
2021-07-02 05:15 ` Daniel Westermann (DWE) <daniel.westermann@dbi-services.com>
2021-07-02 17:36 ` Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us>
2021-07-05 14:30 ` Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
2021-07-02 14:47 ` Euler Taveira <euler@eulerto.com>
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