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From: David Steele <david@pgmasters.net>
To: Andres Freund <andres@anarazel.de>
Cc: Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Cc: Michael Paquier <michael@paquier.xyz>
Cc: Postgres hackers <pgsql-hackers@lists.postgresql.org>
Subject: Re: Add recovery to pg_control and remove backup_label
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2023 13:41:15 -0400
Message-ID: <62013cd7-b2a6-477e-b8dd-9a27be3073e0@pgmasters.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20231120204110.ofcmzdjbjlas4kuy@awork3.anarazel.de>
References: <fb5a0e35-0ac0-4265-b0fe-135638adecd0@pgmasters.net>
	<ZVVcZ2HooBnhld_z@paquier.xyz>
	<a1d77886-97ac-4ec3-8f5d-7f0d95cbdc1e@pgmasters.net>
	<ZVqzRSbi2feDhmf7@paquier.xyz>
	<CA+TgmoZqyarS2ud8PXywh_+r6tsss4_D3=F+8PVSaa2MO+HPkA@mail.gmail.com>
	<38b212b7-b8c0-46ea-940b-f27ec3a24deb@pgmasters.net>
	<CA+TgmoYo1Gu5+0xy7-ivmjsdDfCPDPyyV+yL66XjMeOwTCEAFA@mail.gmail.com>
	<c4adaf22-b3f4-4902-acd5-53ec07e88c3c@pgmasters.net>
	<CA+Tgmoae7=XFBMfBEW7YOCASq7_sv4ohT9T8PyQnz70VVco42Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<75071637-6b5c-483b-ac55-9c15b69eaca0@pgmasters.net>
	<20231120204110.ofcmzdjbjlas4kuy@awork3.anarazel.de>

On 11/20/23 16:41, Andres Freund wrote:
> 
> On 2023-11-20 15:56:19 -0400, David Steele wrote:
>> I understand this is an option -- but does it need to be? What is the
>> benefit of excluding the manifest?
> 
> It's not free to create the manifest, particularly if checksums are enabled.

It's virtually free, even with the basic CRCs. Anyway, would you really 
want a backup without a manifest? How would you know something is 
missing? In particular, for page incremental how do you know something 
is new (but not WAL logged) if there is no manifest? Is the plan to just 
recopy anything not WAL logged with each incremental?

> Also, for external backups, there's no manifest...

There certainly is a manifest for many external backup solutions. Not 
having a manifest is just running with scissors, backup-wise.

Regards,
-David





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