public inbox for [email protected]
help / color / mirror / Atom feedFrom: Stefanie Janine Stölting <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
To: Lætitia Avrot <[email protected]>
To: Valeria Kaplan <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Q&A at Postgres Women talk at pgconf.eu
Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2019 13:28:29 +0200
Message-ID: <[email protected]> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAB_COdiA6nyMEqDZWTizCGOYPmAFnAFvi7CRkfAiPrLeazQ2zw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB_COdhF5AHhkCL-m23fx0W17GbH=S66mHK1mZXKpq=66TZedw@mail.gmail.com>
<CAPcrru6+VM3aB9QDVP4orWq6VX+rFO9WutA-vOJ_CtMg7DYu0g@mail.gmail.com>
<CAB_COdiA6nyMEqDZWTizCGOYPmAFnAFvi7CRkfAiPrLeazQ2zw@mail.gmail.com>
Hi all,
This is just my impression of what happened.
I felt exactly the same as Lætitia as it happened. I only got it right afterwards in the discussion with the guy (sorry, forgot the name).
If he'd asked that as a question " what can we/I do in case this question turns up..." it would have been a different case, we could than just have told him to discuss this afterwards and we would have pointed to the importance of that question and what could be done/said in such cases.
It's fair enough to come up with that question as someone who isn't targeted by this in exactly that talk.
Maybe we should put some sources together and point to them when that question will come up again.
Cheers
Stefanie
Am 19. Oktober 2019 09:43:59 MESZ schrieb "Lætitia Avrot" <[email protected]>:
>Hi Valeria,
>
>As I said, impostor syndrom kicks really hard women and as a woman in
>tech,
>I got the "you're not here because you're good but because you're a
>woman"
>assertion so many times in my career that when the guy pointed that
>out, my
>head was like "not that argument again".
>
>And I know for a fact that several women were given that kind of speech
>here at pgconfeu this year. I felt like I didn't want new postgres
>women to
>be confronted with that so soon. That's why I ended firmly the
>conversation.
>
>The thing about that is we work hard to give great abstracts to CFPs.
>That's a fact and it's not questionable. We have no way to know if our
>gender is used in favor or against us during the selection, so on what
>data
>should we rely? Facts or hypothesis?
>
>Am I selected because my abstract is good, because I'm a woman or
>because
>I'm now well-known in the community? There is no way to answer that
>question and I know that question very well because it's always in my
>head.
>I finally decided that it didn't matter. I'm me and people give me room
>to
>speech, so I take it.
>
>The other thing I'd like to ask is "Do you know a white male speaker
>who
>asks himself if he was selected because he's a white man?". No. They
>simply
>don't put it that way because being a white man is the 'default'.
>
>Finally, I totally understand your point and our answer might have been
>a
>bit too emotional because based on fear generated by multiple wrong
>past
>experiences. Thank you for having pointed that out and we'll get
>better.
>
>Have a nice day,
>
>Lætitia
>
>Le ven. 18 oct. 2019 à 17:49, Valeria Kaplan <[email protected]> a écrit
>:
>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> In light of openness and acceptance within our community I just
>wanted to
>> raise an issue that I've seen happen during a Q&A session at the
>conference
>> and hear your thoughts.
>>
>> During a Postgres Women Q&A session at pgconf.eu there was a question
>> from one of the attendees that I don't think was handled very well.
>The
>> question was from a guy who raised, in my opinion, a very valid point
>about
>> increasing the number of female speakers at events. He wasn't able to
>> finish his question as the microphone has been taken from him and as
>he
>> wanted to comment further he wasn't given a microphone back.
>>
>> This actually made me feel a bit uneasy since I feel if we want
>equality
>> in the community we must treat any questions people have with respect
>and
>> snatching a microphone from them is a lack of basic courtesy that one
>> expects regardless to the gender, believe etc.
>>
>> Postgres Women is a fantastic initiative and I think the key is not
>to act
>> towards the majority in a way that we wouldn't tolerate as their
>behaviour
>> towards minority. This might send a wrong message and actually have
>an
>> opposite effect than what we are trying to achieve in the community.
>>
>> Sincerely,
>> Valeria
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 6:37 PM Lætitia Avrot
><[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> As I'm still learning and not so good at organizing things, I didn't
>>> think to take people's e-mail to contact them, so I have no other
>way than
>>> sending this invitation here to everyone. We'll get better next
>time.
>>>
>>> Some quick information here :
>>> - the dinner is sponsor, you just need to take care of your drinks
>>> - the dinner time is 7:30 PM
>>> - the restaurant is Ristorante Tagiura (please, find map enclosed)
>>> - before the dinner, we'll find a place to have a drink only with
>women
>>> (we're actively looking for a place)
>>>
>>> Have a nice day,
>>>
>>> Lætitia
>>>
>>> --
>>> *Paper doesn’t grow on trees. Please print responsibly.*
>>>
>>
view thread (10+ messages) latest in thread
reply
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Reply to all the recipients using the --to and --cc options:
reply via email
To: [email protected]
Cc: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re: Q&A at Postgres Women talk at pgconf.eu
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
This inbox is served by agora; see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox